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> need for urgent action funny because most contaminants in water and air come from China and India what is the UK environmental minister going to do about th

> need for urgent action funny because most contaminants in water and air come from China and India what is the UK environmental minister going to do about that? unless the rest of the world agrees on the need on both regulate local industry and heavily tax import from unregulated countries nothing is going to change for the planet situation the rest are mostly feel-good measures that carry increased cost on the population without shifting the global scenario very much.

A2017U1 8y ago
China and India emit far less per person than any Western country while simultaneously producing the most carbon intensive goods for Westerners and having that counted on their tally. Unless you are willing to flat out say that you think an Indian or Chinese life isn't worth a Western one this line of debate falls apart. Who produced the vast majority of emissions up until 20 years ago? It's rank hypocrisy.
- LoSboccacc 8y ago
  feels like you all read only half of the comment before getting blinded by righteous outrage the whole point I was making is that local policies end up with outsourced pollution, so it's an issue to be either tackeld internationally, which is unrealistic, or coupled with local protectionism, to the same effect of projecting the policy outward
NeedMoreTea 8y ago
> come from China and India Utterly irrelevant. Everywhere needs to take action to solve the issue, USA, China and India especially. Both China and India are investing heavily in renewables, though clearly they have some way to go. The odd one out, presently, is the USA. I expect that to change soon enough. Doesn't matter who goes first, who does more, or when, just that everyone takes enough action. You'll be able to level the same criticism against any of the first countries that start inching toward acknowledging and starting to change the system. Still doesn't matter. Even if it's not yet enough. Only the end result does. Maybe it will eventually come to sanctions and closing trade to nations that aren't doing enough. Simply put, someone has to go first, the first step is never enough.
- LoSboccacc 8y ago
  > someone has to go first but that's the point, European countries have done a lot and the only result was most pollution intensive production was pushed abroad while destroying local productions chains, the lower classes and raising the cost of living to the point the middle class is unable to build the saving to promote healthy growth, meanwhile the planet is still as fucked as it were

A2017U1 8y ago

China and India emit far less per person than any Western country while simultaneously producing the most carbon intensive goods for Westerners and having that counted on their tally. Unless you are willing to flat out say that you think an Indian or Chinese life isn't worth a Western one this line of debate falls apart. Who produced the vast majority of emissions up until 20 years ago? It's rank hypocrisy.

LoSboccacc 8y ago
feels like you all read only half of the comment before getting blinded by righteous outrage the whole point I was making is that local policies end up with outsourced pollution, so it's an issue to be either tackeld internationally, which is unrealistic, or coupled with local protectionism, to the same effect of projecting the policy outward

NeedMoreTea 8y ago

> come from China and India Utterly irrelevant. Everywhere needs to take action to solve the issue, USA, China and India especially. Both China and India are investing heavily in renewables, though clearly they have some way to go. The odd one out, presently, is the USA. I expect that to change soon enough. Doesn't matter who goes first, who does more, or when, just that everyone takes enough action. You'll be able to level the same criticism against any of the first countries that start inching toward acknowledging and starting to change the system. Still doesn't matter. Even if it's not yet enough. Only the end result does. Maybe it will eventually come to sanctions and closing trade to nations that aren't doing enough. Simply put, someone has to go first, the first step is never enough.

LoSboccacc 8y ago
> someone has to go first but that's the point, European countries have done a lot and the only result was most pollution intensive production was pushed abroad while destroying local productions chains, the lower classes and raising the cost of living to the point the middle class is unable to build the saving to promote healthy growth, meanwhile the planet is still as fucked as it were