5 ms·

I'd love to share your enthusiasm but until we get macOS-level consistent touchpad gestures, rock-solid stability, instant wake from suspend without draining ba

I'd love to share your enthusiasm but until we get macOS-level consistent touchpad gestures, rock-solid stability, instant wake from suspend without draining battery consistently, great GPU drivers, ...(I can go on), it is difficult to proclaim that. I love developing on Linux too, and I really want it to be the best, but it's just not there yet.

yjftsjthsd-h 7y ago
Mac OS supports exactly one line of hardware. So let's pick exactly one line of Hardware to run Linux so it's a fair comparison. I nominate either thinkpads or Dell XPS. Now then, in a fair comparison... > consistent touchpad gestures, GNOME has this. > rock-solid stability, Yep. > instant wake from suspend without draining battery consistently, Has that even been a problem this decade? > great GPU drivers I defy you to claim that great GPU drivers exist on any operating system, but as long as you're not using Nvidia Linux is perfectly good.
- smallstepforman 7y ago
  NVidia Linux is a battery destroying monstrosity. My laptop fans go crazy with nVidia driver, making the laptop unusable. Using no driver gives a pleasant audiable experience (no HW acceleration). Heck, even Haiku with raw framebuffer driver runs more pleasantly than Linux with nVidia driver.
  - vetinari 7y ago
    Officially, Nvidia doesn't support laptop GPUs under Linux. Given the Nvidia attitude towards Linux or third-party drivers, it is no wonder that the current state is as it is. Why someone would purchase such product is up to their decision. They surely should know, that they are getting into unsupported territory, where nobody did any integration. But it is their money they are throwing at Nvidia.
    - alfalfasprout 7y ago
      Well, it's getting better thankfully. Given that most CUDA workloads run in Linux now, we've started seeing a much nicer cadence of releases. Though I agree on the desktop/laptop side there is definitely not feature parity.
- vetinari 7y ago
  >> instant wake from suspend without draining battery consistently, > Has that even been a problem this decade? Actually, it was, when PC vendors decided they don't need ACPI S3 state, and Connected standby is enough. Connected standby requires support from OS, and when it was introduced, only Windows 10 supported it. But not that Macs don't have their sleep issues either. It is a lottery, whether a Mac connected to a TB dock will wake up or not (it will after disconnecting the dock).
- igneo676 7y ago
  Ugh, I just wish there was a slick laptop like the Dell XPS line that both supported Linux AND had a Radeon (or just not-nvidia) graphics card. I've been looking for a viable contender and it appears that it just doesn't exist
  - sandGorgon 7y ago
    is this for gaming ? the Dell XPS 13 is pretty decent when it comes to gaming. I have a 4 year old XPS and it plays a lot of games at lower XPS - im assuming the newer ones are even better. The Ryzens are obviously in another league altogether here, but unless we get a Ryzen XPS, the Intel XPS are not bad.
  - keypusher 7y ago
    Purism makes very nice Linux laptops with Intel graphics chips.
omnifischer 7y ago
Why still this obsession with battery life? Every where I go trains, bus, hotel even cafes, airlines offer free power. Look at health! Ideally for helping keep my eye sight I need proper matte screen. Staying with dell/thinkpad lines are the only option
lnkmails 7y ago
I have a thinkpad X1 carbon and been running Fedora 30 beta for a month now. I am yet to see any issues in touchpad or stability. Gnome shell crashes every now and then but if they didn't notify me about it, I won't even know about it. S3 suspend works great and flicker free boot is a nice icing on the cake. I switched over from 2014 macbook pro and love the weight, keyboard and overall black finish with matte screen. I dual boot F30 and Windows 10. I don't boot up windows unless I have to do something in MS Office. The app ecosystem is worse than the hardware support for me. I don't have outlook or any of the MS products as native app (I use web version of O365 which works well). I miss a native app for Notion. Other than these, F30 has been amazing. I won't ever go back to Ubuntu on a laptop. Against, OS X, app ecosystem still lags but tolerable.

yjftsjthsd-h 7y ago

Mac OS supports exactly one line of hardware. So let's pick exactly one line of Hardware to run Linux so it's a fair comparison. I nominate either thinkpads or Dell XPS. Now then, in a fair comparison... > consistent touchpad gestures, GNOME has this. > rock-solid stability, Yep. > instant wake from suspend without draining battery consistently, Has that even been a problem this decade? > great GPU drivers I defy you to claim that great GPU drivers exist on any operating system, but as long as you're not using Nvidia Linux is perfectly good.

smallstepforman 7y ago
NVidia Linux is a battery destroying monstrosity. My laptop fans go crazy with nVidia driver, making the laptop unusable. Using no driver gives a pleasant audiable experience (no HW acceleration). Heck, even Haiku with raw framebuffer driver runs more pleasantly than Linux with nVidia driver.
- vetinari 7y ago
  Officially, Nvidia doesn't support laptop GPUs under Linux. Given the Nvidia attitude towards Linux or third-party drivers, it is no wonder that the current state is as it is. Why someone would purchase such product is up to their decision. They surely should know, that they are getting into unsupported territory, where nobody did any integration. But it is their money they are throwing at Nvidia.
  - alfalfasprout 7y ago
    Well, it's getting better thankfully. Given that most CUDA workloads run in Linux now, we've started seeing a much nicer cadence of releases. Though I agree on the desktop/laptop side there is definitely not feature parity.
vetinari 7y ago
>> instant wake from suspend without draining battery consistently, > Has that even been a problem this decade? Actually, it was, when PC vendors decided they don't need ACPI S3 state, and Connected standby is enough. Connected standby requires support from OS, and when it was introduced, only Windows 10 supported it. But not that Macs don't have their sleep issues either. It is a lottery, whether a Mac connected to a TB dock will wake up or not (it will after disconnecting the dock).
igneo676 7y ago
Ugh, I just wish there was a slick laptop like the Dell XPS line that both supported Linux AND had a Radeon (or just not-nvidia) graphics card. I've been looking for a viable contender and it appears that it just doesn't exist
- sandGorgon 7y ago
  is this for gaming ? the Dell XPS 13 is pretty decent when it comes to gaming. I have a 4 year old XPS and it plays a lot of games at lower XPS - im assuming the newer ones are even better. The Ryzens are obviously in another league altogether here, but unless we get a Ryzen XPS, the Intel XPS are not bad.
- keypusher 7y ago
  Purism makes very nice Linux laptops with Intel graphics chips.

omnifischer 7y ago

Why still this obsession with battery life? Every where I go trains, bus, hotel even cafes, airlines offer free power. Look at health! Ideally for helping keep my eye sight I need proper matte screen. Staying with dell/thinkpad lines are the only option

lnkmails 7y ago

I have a thinkpad X1 carbon and been running Fedora 30 beta for a month now. I am yet to see any issues in touchpad or stability. Gnome shell crashes every now and then but if they didn't notify me about it, I won't even know about it. S3 suspend works great and flicker free boot is a nice icing on the cake. I switched over from 2014 macbook pro and love the weight, keyboard and overall black finish with matte screen. I dual boot F30 and Windows 10. I don't boot up windows unless I have to do something in MS Office. The app ecosystem is worse than the hardware support for me. I don't have outlook or any of the MS products as native app (I use web version of O365 which works well). I miss a native app for Notion. Other than these, F30 has been amazing. I won't ever go back to Ubuntu on a laptop. Against, OS X, app ecosystem still lags but tolerable.