3 ms·

'socialism' as it is traditionally understood is a post-enlightenment philosophy specifically positing that the church is a tool of the ruling classes used to s

by cat199 8y ago

'socialism' as it is traditionally understood is a post-enlightenment philosophy specifically positing that the church is a tool of the ruling classes used to surpress the workers.. while there are some (many!) strands of christian ethics/social philosophy espousing a collectivist material position, and many (most) of these predate this type of socialism, these are christian and not socialist (due to the aforementioned distinction) - i'm not an expert here, but I am quite confident that these strands were never (mis)labeled as 'socialist' until after the arrival of the paris commune / marx / bakunin, etc.

msla 8y ago
Without going too far off-topic: Marxist Socialism is inherently anti-religious, but there were Socialist traditions before Marx, and a number of them were Christian in philosophy. The Diggers in Seventeenth Century England are one example, and there's still a non-Marxist strain of Socialism in the Liberation Theology movement. So, is Socialism inherently anti-religious? Only if you think the Marxists own the term.
- cat199 8y ago
  as mentioned, not an expert - was the term 'socialist' used by any of the pre-internationale groups? would they identify as such? or as christian with a particular emphasis? either way, in common discourse 'socialist' is not the same as 'socially oriented'; 99.9% of the time (and also i posit for this article) it is pretty safe to assume that the reference relates to one or another group claiming some ideological lineage to the paris commune / 1st internationale seeking the abolishment of capitalism, private property, and religious authority. this is still true even for mainstream european socialist parties, etc, even if they don't promote strict adherence so much these days (and so are more 'social democratic') also: many anarchists are socialists but not marxists, though they do agree with the class theory part..

by cat199 8y ago

msla 8y ago

Without going too far off-topic: Marxist Socialism is inherently anti-religious, but there were Socialist traditions before Marx, and a number of them were Christian in philosophy. The Diggers in Seventeenth Century England are one example, and there's still a non-Marxist strain of Socialism in the Liberation Theology movement. So, is Socialism inherently anti-religious? Only if you think the Marxists own the term.

cat199 8y ago
as mentioned, not an expert - was the term 'socialist' used by any of the pre-internationale groups? would they identify as such? or as christian with a particular emphasis? either way, in common discourse 'socialist' is not the same as 'socially oriented'; 99.9% of the time (and also i posit for this article) it is pretty safe to assume that the reference relates to one or another group claiming some ideological lineage to the paris commune / 1st internationale seeking the abolishment of capitalism, private property, and religious authority. this is still true even for mainstream european socialist parties, etc, even if they don't promote strict adherence so much these days (and so are more 'social democratic') also: many anarchists are socialists but not marxists, though they do agree with the class theory part..