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"because it's not healthy to have all the country's leadership and wealth concentrated in one place." Has there been any research on this? It seems a pretty c

"because it's not healthy to have all the country's leadership and wealth concentrated in one place." Has there been any research on this? It seems a pretty common pattern to have the gov't capital, financial center, largest population center and largest GDP producing cities all be the same place. This holds true in (more or less) stable industrialized countries like France, Japan, S. Korea, etc. as well as in many 3rd world countries. I have a vague feeling its unhealthy, but that's admittedly probably at least partly because I grew up in the States, where it isn't the case and gives me something of a bias against it. And presumably there's a reason its such a popular model, even if it hasn't been a conscious decision in most cases.

alexis_fr 7y ago
Congrats for identifying a potential bias and trying to address it. It’s out of topic (albeit at the core of the reason they try to move Jakarta, so worth studying), but more importantly, extremely large amounts of people, even among very clever ones even on HN, forget to identify the bias that they may not notice because they’re inside it. Would you have any guess on what gave you this reflex? I believe I took this reflex by moving to 4 different countries. It makes it easy to notice locality-based bias. But I always wonder how people learnt, when they notice a potential political or environmental bias.
jcranmer 7y ago
I was going to say it's pretty common not to have the major city (largest finance/population/GDP, pretty much all correlates of one another), but it's actually not. Excluding countries that explicitly moved their capital from the largest city (e.g., Brazil), the major countries with this setup are Australia, Bolivia, Cameroon, Canada, Ecuador, Morocco, New Zealand, South Africa, Switzerland, Turkey, UAE, US, and Vietnam. And most of those countries boil down to "we took several regions and agglomerated them into one entity," where the capital is either unchanged from one of the old constituents (e.g., Turkey--Ankara was the capital during the Turkish rebellion) or was sited in a middle point to not favor one constituent (e.g., Canada). It's just that I'm more familiar with the exceptions than the rule.
- dmurray 7y ago
  This list is suspiciously incomplete, how are China and India not on it? In both of the world's most populous countries, the largest city and indisputable financial centre is not the capital. I would guess the majority of the world's population lives in countries where this is the situation, so it's not just you.
  - jcranmer 7y ago
    In India, the metropolitan region of Delhi is larger than the metropolitan region of Mumbai, even if the cities proper are reversed. For China, I wasn't certain of the metropolitan region comparison between Shanghai and Beijing.
  - jpatokal 7y ago
    The commercial cities in question, Mumbai and Shanghai, have never been the capitals of India or China. Delhi was built as a new capital by the British Raj, taking over from Calcutta. Beijing's history is long and complicated, but it has been the capital of unified China since 1421, give or take a few blips during wars.
elihu 7y ago
I don't know of any specific research. I've been to Jakarta and have friends who live in Indonesia, so my opinion is based largely on their impressions of the political situation there, that it's a basically a geographical hierarchy: Jakarta is where the money and power are, Java is fairly modern and somewhat middle-class and is where the majority of the population live, and the other islands are mostly treated as primitive and as a source of natural resources to be exploited. I don't know if that's still true or if Indonesia has made progress in recent years in balancing out the political power.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

alexis_fr 7y ago

Congrats for identifying a potential bias and trying to address it. It’s out of topic (albeit at the core of the reason they try to move Jakarta, so worth studying), but more importantly, extremely large amounts of people, even among very clever ones even on HN, forget to identify the bias that they may not notice because they’re inside it. Would you have any guess on what gave you this reflex? I believe I took this reflex by moving to 4 different countries. It makes it easy to notice locality-based bias. But I always wonder how people learnt, when they notice a potential political or environmental bias.

jcranmer 7y ago

I was going to say it's pretty common not to have the major city (largest finance/population/GDP, pretty much all correlates of one another), but it's actually not. Excluding countries that explicitly moved their capital from the largest city (e.g., Brazil), the major countries with this setup are Australia, Bolivia, Cameroon, Canada, Ecuador, Morocco, New Zealand, South Africa, Switzerland, Turkey, UAE, US, and Vietnam. And most of those countries boil down to "we took several regions and agglomerated them into one entity," where the capital is either unchanged from one of the old constituents (e.g., Turkey--Ankara was the capital during the Turkish rebellion) or was sited in a middle point to not favor one constituent (e.g., Canada). It's just that I'm more familiar with the exceptions than the rule.

dmurray 7y ago
This list is suspiciously incomplete, how are China and India not on it? In both of the world's most populous countries, the largest city and indisputable financial centre is not the capital. I would guess the majority of the world's population lives in countries where this is the situation, so it's not just you.
- jcranmer 7y ago
  In India, the metropolitan region of Delhi is larger than the metropolitan region of Mumbai, even if the cities proper are reversed. For China, I wasn't certain of the metropolitan region comparison between Shanghai and Beijing.
- jpatokal 7y ago
  The commercial cities in question, Mumbai and Shanghai, have never been the capitals of India or China. Delhi was built as a new capital by the British Raj, taking over from Calcutta. Beijing's history is long and complicated, but it has been the capital of unified China since 1421, give or take a few blips during wars.

elihu 7y ago

I don't know of any specific research. I've been to Jakarta and have friends who live in Indonesia, so my opinion is based largely on their impressions of the political situation there, that it's a basically a geographical hierarchy: Jakarta is where the money and power are, Java is fairly modern and somewhat middle-class and is where the majority of the population live, and the other islands are mostly treated as primitive and as a source of natural resources to be exploited. I don't know if that's still true or if Indonesia has made progress in recent years in balancing out the political power.

deleted 7y ago

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