4 ms·

Good luck. China owns Hong Kong. Since the mainland gets to decide who runs in major elections, there is only an illusion of independence.

JumpCrisscross 7y ago
> China owns Hong Kong Not yet [1], not technically. Hong Kong, through the UK, has legal redress in international law which would at least make overt subjugation politically costly for Beijing. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handover_of_Hong_Kong https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handover_of_Hong_Kong
- meddlepal 7y ago
  Nobody is going to start WW3 over China tightening its grip on Hong Kong at this point. Because the west and China's economies are so tightly intertwined a war would be disasturous economically and militarily and for what purpose to prevent the inevitable 30 years early? Heck sanctions are almost pointless too. The closer the 2047 deadline gets the tighter the control will become.
- ryder9 7y ago
  Great video by Vox on the topic https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQyxG4vTyZ8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQyxG4vTyZ8
- Mediterraneo10 7y ago
  > Hong Kong, through the UK, has legal redress in international law The UK has gradually lost interest in ensuring that Hong Kong’s Basic Law is respected. For the UK, fighting for Hong Kong would jeopardize its relationship with the mainland, which is much more important in terms of business and trade. Plus, mainland China has become more assertive and its leadership claims that China is rising back up again after the colonial era kept it down – an era in which the UK played no small role, both in the Opium Wars and in holding Hong Kong as a colonial possession. That means that if the UK tries to really fight for Hong Kong, it will be attacked for acting like a meddling colonial power again. The UK is just too sensitive to the propaganda campaign that China could throw at it.
  - JumpCrisscross 7y ago
    > the UK has lost interest in ensuring that Hong Kong’s Basic Law is respected I agree. When I say through the UK, I mean through the UK’s standing in international law. That gives Hong Kong the ability to petition various bodies and sue in certain courts. It also gives legitimacy to e.g. the U.S. taking it on as a cause. TL; DR There are ways for Hong Kong to make an overt treaty violation costly to Beijing. Unless Beijing is concerned about an imminent threat to its legitimacy and power, it’s unlikely to find those costs worth incurring.
    - hdkrgr 7y ago
      And when you say 'Hong Kong' can sue, you mean its pro-Beijing government?
      - JumpCrisscross 7y ago
        > when you say 'Hong Kong' can sue, you mean its pro-Beijing government? When I sign contracts with a company, I negotiate against the imaginary dick who replaces the gentleman I know. Agreements outlast their signers. Politics can change.
        bobthepanda 7y ago
        The head of Hong Kong's government is elected via a council mostly consisting of business interests with huge incentives to keep the territory's main trading partner (China) happy. Any change to this would require amending the Basic Law, which only China is allowed to do. Nothing short of a coup would change the current situation.

JumpCrisscross 7y ago

> China owns Hong Kong Not yet [1], not technically. Hong Kong, through the UK, has legal redress in international law which would at least make overt subjugation politically costly for Beijing. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handover_of_Hong_Kong https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handover_of_Hong_Kong

meddlepal 7y ago
Nobody is going to start WW3 over China tightening its grip on Hong Kong at this point. Because the west and China's economies are so tightly intertwined a war would be disasturous economically and militarily and for what purpose to prevent the inevitable 30 years early? Heck sanctions are almost pointless too. The closer the 2047 deadline gets the tighter the control will become.
ryder9 7y ago
Great video by Vox on the topic https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQyxG4vTyZ8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQyxG4vTyZ8
Mediterraneo10 7y ago
> Hong Kong, through the UK, has legal redress in international law The UK has gradually lost interest in ensuring that Hong Kong’s Basic Law is respected. For the UK, fighting for Hong Kong would jeopardize its relationship with the mainland, which is much more important in terms of business and trade. Plus, mainland China has become more assertive and its leadership claims that China is rising back up again after the colonial era kept it down – an era in which the UK played no small role, both in the Opium Wars and in holding Hong Kong as a colonial possession. That means that if the UK tries to really fight for Hong Kong, it will be attacked for acting like a meddling colonial power again. The UK is just too sensitive to the propaganda campaign that China could throw at it.
- JumpCrisscross 7y ago
  > the UK has lost interest in ensuring that Hong Kong’s Basic Law is respected I agree. When I say through the UK, I mean through the UK’s standing in international law. That gives Hong Kong the ability to petition various bodies and sue in certain courts. It also gives legitimacy to e.g. the U.S. taking it on as a cause. TL; DR There are ways for Hong Kong to make an overt treaty violation costly to Beijing. Unless Beijing is concerned about an imminent threat to its legitimacy and power, it’s unlikely to find those costs worth incurring.
  - hdkrgr 7y ago
    And when you say 'Hong Kong' can sue, you mean its pro-Beijing government?
    - JumpCrisscross 7y ago
      > when you say 'Hong Kong' can sue, you mean its pro-Beijing government? When I sign contracts with a company, I negotiate against the imaginary dick who replaces the gentleman I know. Agreements outlast their signers. Politics can change.
      - bobthepanda 7y ago
        The head of Hong Kong's government is elected via a council mostly consisting of business interests with huge incentives to keep the territory's main trading partner (China) happy. Any change to this would require amending the Basic Law, which only China is allowed to do. Nothing short of a coup would change the current situation.