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> That’s a perverted view of the “public interest” as being diametrically opposed to corporate interests. The goal of corporations is to extract as much money

by deogeo 8y ago

> That’s a perverted view of the “public interest” as being diametrically opposed to corporate interests. The goal of corporations is to extract as much money as possible from the public. So in a very real sense, they are opponents, even if sometimes their interests align.

rayiner 8y ago
Corporations give people goods and services in exchange. (And almost everyone gets the money in the first place by working for a corporation.) Their interests are highly aligned.
- JohnFen 8y ago
  > Their interests are highly aligned. It sure doesn't seem like it to me. Corporations are about maximizing profits, which in part means soaking people to greatest degree possible. It would be easier to support the notion that their interests are "highly aligned" if corporations had an incentive to make a reasonable profit rather than the most profit they can get away with.
  - rayiner 8y ago
    Corporations make a profit by giving people what the people want. Apple makes tons of profits because it innovates and gives people products they love. Same thing for Walmart and Amazon. (It turns out that what people love is cheap crap delivered instantly, but that is what it is.) Same thing for Exxon. (People love cheap gas so they can drive their SUVs to Chipotle and Exxon delivers that.) It’s entities that don’t have s profit motive that tend to be the least customer focused. If you rely on the New York or DC subway, it will become quite apparent that those organizations are focused on maximizing value for their respective labor unions rather than for their customers. Same thing for schools. (There is a reason people send their kids to private school even in places where the public schools are good.)
    - deogeo 8y ago
      Microsoft makes a profit by charging for secret patents on Android, and by pushing the use of patented FAT and exFAT filesystems, instead of patent-free alternatives. Google makes a profit through pervasive spying. Pharmaceutical companies make huge profits by forbidding the import of medicine from abroad, even when it's the exact same medicine they sell. Or by selling HIV-tainted blood (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contaminated_haemophilia_blood_products https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contaminated_haemophilia_blood...). Tobacco companies made billions by pervasive advertising to convince people smoking is cool. Banks profited by re-ordering payments so they could charge more overdrafts (https://medium.com/@harvestplatform/re-ordering-transactions-absolutely-affects-everyone-with-a-bank-account-f13b9a587de6 https://medium.com/@harvestplatform/re-ordering-transactions...). And all companies make a profit by paying their workers as little as they can, while charging as much as they can for their product. There are ethical and unethical ways to turn a profit, and large companies tend to ignore the distinction. So it's difficult for me to imagine the degree of willful blindness required to say that the interests of people and corporations are mostly aligned, or that that is "what the people want".
    - JohnFen 8y ago
      > Corporations make a profit by giving people what the people want. In part. In part, they make a profit by engaging in activities that nobody outside of corporations want, up to and including things that are harmful to society (and business) as a whole. The larger the corporation, it seems, the more of their profit comes from the latter.
- andrekandre 8y ago
  In addition to selling goods, sometimes they also sell bads: https://www.thebalance.com/credit-default-swaps-pros-cons-crises-examples-3305920 https://www.thebalance.com/credit-default-swaps-pros-cons-cr... I would be skeptical of any corporation writing public laws and even a certain A. Smith seems to agree[1] [1] (right hand column) https://books.google.co.jp/books?id=rpMuAAAAYAAJ&hl=ja&pg=PA107#v=onepage&q&f=false https://books.google.co.jp/books?id=rpMuAAAAYAAJ&hl=ja&pg=PA...

by deogeo 8y ago

rayiner 8y ago

Corporations give people goods and services in exchange. (And almost everyone gets the money in the first place by working for a corporation.) Their interests are highly aligned.

JohnFen 8y ago
> Their interests are highly aligned. It sure doesn't seem like it to me. Corporations are about maximizing profits, which in part means soaking people to greatest degree possible. It would be easier to support the notion that their interests are "highly aligned" if corporations had an incentive to make a reasonable profit rather than the most profit they can get away with.
- rayiner 8y ago
  Corporations make a profit by giving people what the people want. Apple makes tons of profits because it innovates and gives people products they love. Same thing for Walmart and Amazon. (It turns out that what people love is cheap crap delivered instantly, but that is what it is.) Same thing for Exxon. (People love cheap gas so they can drive their SUVs to Chipotle and Exxon delivers that.) It’s entities that don’t have s profit motive that tend to be the least customer focused. If you rely on the New York or DC subway, it will become quite apparent that those organizations are focused on maximizing value for their respective labor unions rather than for their customers. Same thing for schools. (There is a reason people send their kids to private school even in places where the public schools are good.)
  - deogeo 8y ago
    Microsoft makes a profit by charging for secret patents on Android, and by pushing the use of patented FAT and exFAT filesystems, instead of patent-free alternatives. Google makes a profit through pervasive spying. Pharmaceutical companies make huge profits by forbidding the import of medicine from abroad, even when it's the exact same medicine they sell. Or by selling HIV-tainted blood (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contaminated_haemophilia_blood_products https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contaminated_haemophilia_blood...). Tobacco companies made billions by pervasive advertising to convince people smoking is cool. Banks profited by re-ordering payments so they could charge more overdrafts (https://medium.com/@harvestplatform/re-ordering-transactions-absolutely-affects-everyone-with-a-bank-account-f13b9a587de6 https://medium.com/@harvestplatform/re-ordering-transactions...). And all companies make a profit by paying their workers as little as they can, while charging as much as they can for their product. There are ethical and unethical ways to turn a profit, and large companies tend to ignore the distinction. So it's difficult for me to imagine the degree of willful blindness required to say that the interests of people and corporations are mostly aligned, or that that is "what the people want".
  - JohnFen 8y ago
    > Corporations make a profit by giving people what the people want. In part. In part, they make a profit by engaging in activities that nobody outside of corporations want, up to and including things that are harmful to society (and business) as a whole. The larger the corporation, it seems, the more of their profit comes from the latter.
andrekandre 8y ago
In addition to selling goods, sometimes they also sell bads: https://www.thebalance.com/credit-default-swaps-pros-cons-crises-examples-3305920 https://www.thebalance.com/credit-default-swaps-pros-cons-cr... I would be skeptical of any corporation writing public laws and even a certain A. Smith seems to agree[1] [1] (right hand column) https://books.google.co.jp/books?id=rpMuAAAAYAAJ&hl=ja&pg=PA107#v=onepage&q&f=false https://books.google.co.jp/books?id=rpMuAAAAYAAJ&hl=ja&pg=PA...