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>> A single night of 4 hours sleep, followed by a year of normal nights sleep will lead to a me that is indistinguishable from the me that slept 8 hours that sa

>> A single night of 4 hours sleep, followed by a year of normal nights sleep will lead to a me that is indistinguishable from the me that slept 8 hours that same night. Usually. Except if the 4 hours of sleep leads you to crash your car, or run into a pedestrian, or forget your child in a car. In the usual case, a day of missed sleep is normally OK, but when you are responsible for other people (rather than just code quality/productivity), why risk it? And even in the general case...why risk it? It is far better to lead a normal lifestyle and be at peak performance in all parts of your responsibility.

dllthomas 8y ago
But that's just as true with credit card debt, right? If I couldn't make an important purchase because I hit my limit, my life might be radically different - is it therefore "not debt"?
vageli 8y ago
> Usually. Except if the 4 hours of sleep leads you to crash your car, or run into a pedestrian, or forget your child in a car. > In the usual case, a day of missed sleep is normally OK, but when you are responsible for other people (rather than just code quality/productivity), why risk it? And even in the general case...why risk it? It is far better to lead a normal lifestyle and be at peak performance in all parts of your responsibility. I'm sure most people with responsibilities getting less than their required sleep are not doing it by choice. When I have had to forgo sleep it was out of necessity (primarily to work a second job). Of course it is far better to get the optimal sleep your body needs. It's not about people intentionally engaging in risky behavior needlessly—oftentimes people are trading sleep for putting food on the table, for instance.
- Starwatcher2001 8y ago
  I quite agree with the problem of having to trade sleep for other necessities, but personally I didn't realise the actual cost of that trade, and the serious long term effects that 90+ hour weeks might have on me. In my case it wasn't a second job, it was trying to be more productive to help a fledgling company fly. In retrospect I'd have been a lot more productive with a good 8 hours sleep in my tank every night. Walker's book on sleep opened my eyes that much that I bought copies for all the family. I've never done that before.
- TuringNYC 8y ago
  You're totally right. I was responding to the parent comment which felt temporary sleep deprivation was OK as long as it wasn't long-term. I'm arguing it is not OK even in the short term (not arguing that it is avoidable, just not justifiable as impactless)
shados 8y ago
> or forget your child in a car. Ironically people with kids, especially early on, frequently have 4 hours of sleep...if they're lucky.
theNJR 8y ago
This. In the previously mentioned podcast the host, a former doctor, tells a pretty scary story about being a sleep deprived doctor.

dllthomas 8y ago

But that's just as true with credit card debt, right? If I couldn't make an important purchase because I hit my limit, my life might be radically different - is it therefore "not debt"?

vageli 8y ago

> Usually. Except if the 4 hours of sleep leads you to crash your car, or run into a pedestrian, or forget your child in a car. > In the usual case, a day of missed sleep is normally OK, but when you are responsible for other people (rather than just code quality/productivity), why risk it? And even in the general case...why risk it? It is far better to lead a normal lifestyle and be at peak performance in all parts of your responsibility. I'm sure most people with responsibilities getting less than their required sleep are not doing it by choice. When I have had to forgo sleep it was out of necessity (primarily to work a second job). Of course it is far better to get the optimal sleep your body needs. It's not about people intentionally engaging in risky behavior needlessly—oftentimes people are trading sleep for putting food on the table, for instance.

Starwatcher2001 8y ago
I quite agree with the problem of having to trade sleep for other necessities, but personally I didn't realise the actual cost of that trade, and the serious long term effects that 90+ hour weeks might have on me. In my case it wasn't a second job, it was trying to be more productive to help a fledgling company fly. In retrospect I'd have been a lot more productive with a good 8 hours sleep in my tank every night. Walker's book on sleep opened my eyes that much that I bought copies for all the family. I've never done that before.
TuringNYC 8y ago
You're totally right. I was responding to the parent comment which felt temporary sleep deprivation was OK as long as it wasn't long-term. I'm arguing it is not OK even in the short term (not arguing that it is avoidable, just not justifiable as impactless)

shados 8y ago

> or forget your child in a car. Ironically people with kids, especially early on, frequently have 4 hours of sleep...if they're lucky.

theNJR 8y ago

This. In the previously mentioned podcast the host, a former doctor, tells a pretty scary story about being a sleep deprived doctor.