5 ms·

This is pretty dope, but I'm terrified about the fact that Firefox lets it take over Ctrl+L, Ctrl+1, or any other way (that I can find, at least) of breaking ou

This is pretty dope, but I'm terrified about the fact that Firefox lets it take over Ctrl+L, Ctrl+1, or any other way (that I can find, at least) of breaking out of Vim with a keyboard aside from closing the tab with Ctrl+W - which is even more terrifying since I use that in Vim a ton, too :O ...but this is pretty cool :D

TeMPOraL 7y ago
This is a problem. The browser wants to be a computing platform, so it's injecting itself between the actual OS and the software you'd like to run. But it's still an userland program, so it uses regular keyboard shortcuts. Shortcuts the software you'd like to run needs as well. I had a similar problems with Emacs in the browser (I stumbled upon it a long time ago). The keys I needed the most were also the keys intercepted by the browser.
aasasd 7y ago
The actual issue is that Windows and Linux don't properly use a ‘super’ key―while the ‘Win’ key is sitting there uselessly. Ironically, MS' own ‘ergonomic’ (cough) keyboards have gigantic Win keys, right under the thumbs which are the strongest digits. These keys are great to use on Mac, it's an eye-opener as to how the historical keyboard mutations ended up in just the wrong way for two platforms (and for Emacs). I could also say some things about the nonsensical shape of keyboards and the moronic replication of the typewriters' staggered key layout...
- the_pwner224 7y ago
  > The actual issue is that Windows and Linux don't properly use a ‘super’ key―while the ‘Win’ key is sitting there uselessly. Some people do use the super key. I have it bound to a huge number of actions (WASD to switch workspaces, Alt+WASD to move window to adjacent workspaces, C to close window, X to pause/unpause media, Z to show workspace overview, tab to switch between workspaces like alt-tab does for windows, P and ; to invert colors, F and T to control window tiling, / to bring up the dropdown terminal, and the 4x4 grid from '6' to '.' to go to one of my 16 workspaces). It would be a shame if applications started using 'super' in their keybindings - having a key that is effectively globally reserved for user-configurable actions is very useful. There are no worries about conflicting keybindings when you use super; the same cannot be said of keybindings that use ctrl or even ctrl+alt+letter - for example, many IDEs use ctrl+alt+letter to do stuff, which would mess with global user-configured shortcuts. Perhaps the position could be optimized though.
  - mikewhy 7y ago
    > There are no worries about conflicting keybindings when you use super Aren't there conflicts on most desktops? - Windows, off the top of my head, has Win+R, Win+C, Win+V, Win+x, Win+D, Win+L, Win+E, Win+Directions - Linux (well Ubuntu/Gnome3) has Win+L, Win+R, Win+Mouse, Win+Directions - macOS (considering Ctrl to be super here) has Ctrl+Arrows, along with many common Ctrl+Letters from the unix world
    - the_pwner224 7y ago
      On Windows you can't do anything with super (AFAIK); you are stuck with what Microsoft provides you and that's it. Most Linux desktop environments (Gnome, KDE, etc.) provide default mappings that involve super, but they can all be changed freely by the user. So you can get rid of Win+L or change what it does (at least on KDE, or if you are using just a WM like i3). macOS is just weird, with the cmd/ctrl split.
  - opan 7y ago
    In both i3wm and awesomewm I use super as my main modifier for window management. I am also glad programs don't often touch it so that it's available for this.
- hjk05 7y ago
  I’d love to hear your take on the nonsensical shape and staggered key layout. Do you have suggestions for keyboards that do away with this? I have myself been looking at https://ergodox-ez.com/ https://ergodox-ez.com/ but I’d love to hear of alternatives, especially if you have first hand experience on them.
  - Asooka 7y ago
    Hi, I have experience both with the ergodox and the now-discontinued Truly Ergonomic Computer Keyboard™. The TECK honestly has a slightly better layout for me - the two halves are closer together and seem to fit my hands just a bit better. On the downside, the TECK's hardware quality was atrocious with keys double-pressing or missing presses after about a year of use. It also uses its own microcontroller with its own closed-source firmware so there's nearly no community around it. I'm not sure I can politely explain just how much the TECK fails. The ErgoDox on the other hand has been a joy to use for approximately a year now and its design allowing for wasy swapping of keyswitches plus its open-source firmware mean I have limitless customisability and am not stuck using low-quality chinese cherry-mx clones (kailh). I hear they've actually improved now, but the ones in the TECK were definitely subpar. I use a split ortholinear keyboard because a standard layout keyboard makes my fingers hurt after a while. ErgoDox and TECK(while it worked) were both good enough for mitigating my problems while not being as exotic and unwieldy as a kinesis. I would love to try out a https://shop.keyboard.io/ https://shop.keyboard.io/ once (hopefully) the price comes down a bit.
    - pault 7y ago
      As an avid mechanical keyboard hobbyist with an enormous collection of MX variants (I have 10 ortholinear keyboards in various stages of construction in my living room right now, and about 80 models of switches from various manufacturers), I would argue that kailh had surpassed cherry in quality and selection by a wide margin in recent years. You really should give them another try.
  - ganonm 7y ago
    I've been using the Ergodox EZ for over a year now and it is life-changing. The ergonomic benefits are huge and it forces you to learn to touch type properly. I went through 20 iterations to find a layout optimised for using Vim in Ubuntu - feel free to check it out. https://github.com/Ganon-M/ergodox-vim-ubuntu https://github.com/Ganon-M/ergodox-vim-ubuntu
- zeptomu 7y ago
  > The actual issue is that Windows and Linux don't properly use a ‘super’ key―while the ‘Win’ key is sitting there uselessly. For me (Gnome) the super-key shows an overview of my windows and let's me enter a command which is fairly convenient.
- btym 7y ago
  >The actual issue is that Windows and Linux don't properly use a ‘super’ key―while the ‘Win’ key is sitting there uselessly. >These keys are great to use on Mac The use of the super key on Mac is horrible. It should sit there uselessly, until I tell it to do otherwise. On Mac, here are no safe hotkeys to bind anything to. On Linux, my WM configuration has a ton of actions bound to the super key, and I never have to worry that it will conflict with another application.

TeMPOraL 7y ago

This is a problem. The browser wants to be a computing platform, so it's injecting itself between the actual OS and the software you'd like to run. But it's still an userland program, so it uses regular keyboard shortcuts. Shortcuts the software you'd like to run needs as well. I had a similar problems with Emacs in the browser (I stumbled upon it a long time ago). The keys I needed the most were also the keys intercepted by the browser.

aasasd 7y ago

The actual issue is that Windows and Linux don't properly use a ‘super’ key―while the ‘Win’ key is sitting there uselessly. Ironically, MS' own ‘ergonomic’ (cough) keyboards have gigantic Win keys, right under the thumbs which are the strongest digits. These keys are great to use on Mac, it's an eye-opener as to how the historical keyboard mutations ended up in just the wrong way for two platforms (and for Emacs). I could also say some things about the nonsensical shape of keyboards and the moronic replication of the typewriters' staggered key layout...

the_pwner224 7y ago
> The actual issue is that Windows and Linux don't properly use a ‘super’ key―while the ‘Win’ key is sitting there uselessly. Some people do use the super key. I have it bound to a huge number of actions (WASD to switch workspaces, Alt+WASD to move window to adjacent workspaces, C to close window, X to pause/unpause media, Z to show workspace overview, tab to switch between workspaces like alt-tab does for windows, P and ; to invert colors, F and T to control window tiling, / to bring up the dropdown terminal, and the 4x4 grid from '6' to '.' to go to one of my 16 workspaces). It would be a shame if applications started using 'super' in their keybindings - having a key that is effectively globally reserved for user-configurable actions is very useful. There are no worries about conflicting keybindings when you use super; the same cannot be said of keybindings that use ctrl or even ctrl+alt+letter - for example, many IDEs use ctrl+alt+letter to do stuff, which would mess with global user-configured shortcuts. Perhaps the position could be optimized though.
- mikewhy 7y ago
  > There are no worries about conflicting keybindings when you use super Aren't there conflicts on most desktops? - Windows, off the top of my head, has Win+R, Win+C, Win+V, Win+x, Win+D, Win+L, Win+E, Win+Directions - Linux (well Ubuntu/Gnome3) has Win+L, Win+R, Win+Mouse, Win+Directions - macOS (considering Ctrl to be super here) has Ctrl+Arrows, along with many common Ctrl+Letters from the unix world
  - the_pwner224 7y ago
    On Windows you can't do anything with super (AFAIK); you are stuck with what Microsoft provides you and that's it. Most Linux desktop environments (Gnome, KDE, etc.) provide default mappings that involve super, but they can all be changed freely by the user. So you can get rid of Win+L or change what it does (at least on KDE, or if you are using just a WM like i3). macOS is just weird, with the cmd/ctrl split.
- opan 7y ago
  In both i3wm and awesomewm I use super as my main modifier for window management. I am also glad programs don't often touch it so that it's available for this.
hjk05 7y ago
I’d love to hear your take on the nonsensical shape and staggered key layout. Do you have suggestions for keyboards that do away with this? I have myself been looking at https://ergodox-ez.com/ https://ergodox-ez.com/ but I’d love to hear of alternatives, especially if you have first hand experience on them.
- Asooka 7y ago
  Hi, I have experience both with the ergodox and the now-discontinued Truly Ergonomic Computer Keyboard™. The TECK honestly has a slightly better layout for me - the two halves are closer together and seem to fit my hands just a bit better. On the downside, the TECK's hardware quality was atrocious with keys double-pressing or missing presses after about a year of use. It also uses its own microcontroller with its own closed-source firmware so there's nearly no community around it. I'm not sure I can politely explain just how much the TECK fails. The ErgoDox on the other hand has been a joy to use for approximately a year now and its design allowing for wasy swapping of keyswitches plus its open-source firmware mean I have limitless customisability and am not stuck using low-quality chinese cherry-mx clones (kailh). I hear they've actually improved now, but the ones in the TECK were definitely subpar. I use a split ortholinear keyboard because a standard layout keyboard makes my fingers hurt after a while. ErgoDox and TECK(while it worked) were both good enough for mitigating my problems while not being as exotic and unwieldy as a kinesis. I would love to try out a https://shop.keyboard.io/ https://shop.keyboard.io/ once (hopefully) the price comes down a bit.
  - pault 7y ago
    As an avid mechanical keyboard hobbyist with an enormous collection of MX variants (I have 10 ortholinear keyboards in various stages of construction in my living room right now, and about 80 models of switches from various manufacturers), I would argue that kailh had surpassed cherry in quality and selection by a wide margin in recent years. You really should give them another try.
- ganonm 7y ago
  I've been using the Ergodox EZ for over a year now and it is life-changing. The ergonomic benefits are huge and it forces you to learn to touch type properly. I went through 20 iterations to find a layout optimised for using Vim in Ubuntu - feel free to check it out. https://github.com/Ganon-M/ergodox-vim-ubuntu https://github.com/Ganon-M/ergodox-vim-ubuntu
zeptomu 7y ago
> The actual issue is that Windows and Linux don't properly use a ‘super’ key―while the ‘Win’ key is sitting there uselessly. For me (Gnome) the super-key shows an overview of my windows and let's me enter a command which is fairly convenient.
btym 7y ago
>The actual issue is that Windows and Linux don't properly use a ‘super’ key―while the ‘Win’ key is sitting there uselessly. >These keys are great to use on Mac The use of the super key on Mac is horrible. It should sit there uselessly, until I tell it to do otherwise. On Mac, here are no safe hotkeys to bind anything to. On Linux, my WM configuration has a ton of actions bound to the super key, and I never have to worry that it will conflict with another application.