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I'm not sure they've done things anyone considered impossible. People have said these things will be wildly unprofitable, sure, and so far those people are most

I'm not sure they've done things anyone considered impossible. People have said these things will be wildly unprofitable, sure, and so far those people are mostly right. But nobody has said it would be impossible to build a big expensive electric sedan with high range. Nor did anyone say it would be impossible to build a wide coverage fastcharge network. Surely they are impressive feats, but not "thought to be impossible". In fact, other companies have managed to build similar things. Today the Jaguar and Audi e-SUVs are competing with the Model X, in a few months the Porsche Taycan is competing with Model S, and the ChaDeMo charger network is the same size as the Supercharger one (both have 12,000 units deployed globally).

pbreit 8y ago
First US car company in 60 years, electric at that. Best crash test ratings. Highest owner satisfaction. First US-owned factory in China. Built in about 6 months. Ability and willingness to use OTA updates. Willingness and ability to put auto-pilot on the road for consumers. Ridiculous performance. Better chip than Nvidia. Top 2 auto battery supplier. Best selling lux car in US (ICE or EV). Dramatically better battery efficiency. No dealerships. Online ordering. Plausible FSD story. Camera-based autonomy. $35k price point.
- semi-extrinsic 8y ago
  Apart from the FSD bit, which is still a far way from realized and might never be, none of those things are in the category "people said this was impossible".
  - pbreit 8y ago
    Read the list again.
- dragonwriter 8y ago
  > Plausible FSD story. No. > Camera-based autonomy. That's among the reasons the former isn't true. > $35k price point That PR point has largely been abandoned. I mean, nominally they’ll still sell it to you if you jump through hoops, but they’ve deliberately made it less accessible because, as much as it was an important PR point, it was never really viable.
  - whttheuuu 8y ago
    This comment is the very definition of head in the sand lol.
  - pbreit 8y ago
    Continuing to deny something that exists is actually beyond calling it impossible! If you've got some spare time, go read some third party research on how cameras might actually be better. Lidar superiority is a myth. https://arxiv.org/pdf/1812.07179.pdf https://arxiv.org/pdf/1812.07179.pdf
    - threeseed 8y ago
      That paper says nothing of the sort. Did you even read it ? The numbers actually show pseudo-LiDAR being worse in general and significantly worse at longer distances.
      - pbreit 8y ago
        I read it. Did you? "it is plausible that image-based 3D object detection for autonomous vehicle will become a reality in the near future."
        threeseed 8y ago
        You do know that we have 3D object detection today. In fact we've had it for a few years now. The issue isn't whether it works or not. The issue is whether you need LiDAR in the mix as well. And your paper says unequivocally that the answer is "yes we do".
    - hyperbovine 8y ago
      Dude, if you think a CS conference paper is going to be the secret sauce that extracts Tesla from the $5b hole it’s dig itself into, you a) know nothing about business and b) know nothing about CS.
      - 8y ago
- audunw 8y ago
  > Better chip than Nvidia. That's arguably false. Nvidia has a more powerful FSD chip. But performance/watt might be better for Teslas chip.
- kmlx 8y ago
  wow. here we go: > Best crash test ratings. partly false. there are 30 cars in the same category. kias, hyundays you name it. > Highest owner satisfaction. partly false. only the model 3 got it. model s was dropped due to how crappy it is. > First US-owned factory in China. Built in about 6 months. false. it’s not built. and there are so many other corps out there that own china factories it’s not even funny. > Willingness and ability to put auto-pilot on the road for consumers. how many people died because of this? > Better chip than Nvidia. proven to be false. > Top 2 auto battery supplier. false. that would be Panasonic. > Dramatically better battery efficiency. false. same efficiency as a kia. > No dealerships. this is very bad. > Plausible FSD story. false. debunked. > $35k price point. false. they don’t sell $35k cars.
  - pbreit 8y ago
    I could go down your list and write false as well. To take the first one as an example of how you are wrong. https://www.regulations.gov/document?D=NHTSA-2017-0037-0037 https://www.regulations.gov/document?D=NHTSA-2017-0037-0037 Model 3 not only the very best results, but by a wider margin. And the last. Tesla absolutely sells a $35k Model 3: https://www.tesla.com/blog/update-our-vehicle-lineup https://www.tesla.com/blog/update-our-vehicle-lineup
leesec 8y ago
>I'm not sure they've done things anyone considered impossible. Is this also a joke? They've been doing impossible stuff for literally 10 years, there's plenty examples of people claiming so. Consider this, there isn't a better car than the one they produced in 2012, and GM's best effort at an EV (the Bolt) lost somewhere between 4-8k per unit.

pbreit 8y ago

First US car company in 60 years, electric at that. Best crash test ratings. Highest owner satisfaction. First US-owned factory in China. Built in about 6 months. Ability and willingness to use OTA updates. Willingness and ability to put auto-pilot on the road for consumers. Ridiculous performance. Better chip than Nvidia. Top 2 auto battery supplier. Best selling lux car in US (ICE or EV). Dramatically better battery efficiency. No dealerships. Online ordering. Plausible FSD story. Camera-based autonomy. $35k price point.

semi-extrinsic 8y ago
Apart from the FSD bit, which is still a far way from realized and might never be, none of those things are in the category "people said this was impossible".
- pbreit 8y ago
  Read the list again.
dragonwriter 8y ago
> Plausible FSD story. No. > Camera-based autonomy. That's among the reasons the former isn't true. > $35k price point That PR point has largely been abandoned. I mean, nominally they’ll still sell it to you if you jump through hoops, but they’ve deliberately made it less accessible because, as much as it was an important PR point, it was never really viable.
- whttheuuu 8y ago
  This comment is the very definition of head in the sand lol.
- pbreit 8y ago
  Continuing to deny something that exists is actually beyond calling it impossible! If you've got some spare time, go read some third party research on how cameras might actually be better. Lidar superiority is a myth. https://arxiv.org/pdf/1812.07179.pdf https://arxiv.org/pdf/1812.07179.pdf
  - threeseed 8y ago
    That paper says nothing of the sort. Did you even read it ? The numbers actually show pseudo-LiDAR being worse in general and significantly worse at longer distances.
    - pbreit 8y ago
      I read it. Did you? "it is plausible that image-based 3D object detection for autonomous vehicle will become a reality in the near future."
      - threeseed 8y ago
        You do know that we have 3D object detection today. In fact we've had it for a few years now. The issue isn't whether it works or not. The issue is whether you need LiDAR in the mix as well. And your paper says unequivocally that the answer is "yes we do".
  - hyperbovine 8y ago
    Dude, if you think a CS conference paper is going to be the secret sauce that extracts Tesla from the $5b hole it’s dig itself into, you a) know nothing about business and b) know nothing about CS.
    - 8y ago
audunw 8y ago
> Better chip than Nvidia. That's arguably false. Nvidia has a more powerful FSD chip. But performance/watt might be better for Teslas chip.
kmlx 8y ago
wow. here we go: > Best crash test ratings. partly false. there are 30 cars in the same category. kias, hyundays you name it. > Highest owner satisfaction. partly false. only the model 3 got it. model s was dropped due to how crappy it is. > First US-owned factory in China. Built in about 6 months. false. it’s not built. and there are so many other corps out there that own china factories it’s not even funny. > Willingness and ability to put auto-pilot on the road for consumers. how many people died because of this? > Better chip than Nvidia. proven to be false. > Top 2 auto battery supplier. false. that would be Panasonic. > Dramatically better battery efficiency. false. same efficiency as a kia. > No dealerships. this is very bad. > Plausible FSD story. false. debunked. > $35k price point. false. they don’t sell $35k cars.
- pbreit 8y ago
  I could go down your list and write false as well. To take the first one as an example of how you are wrong. https://www.regulations.gov/document?D=NHTSA-2017-0037-0037 https://www.regulations.gov/document?D=NHTSA-2017-0037-0037 Model 3 not only the very best results, but by a wider margin. And the last. Tesla absolutely sells a $35k Model 3: https://www.tesla.com/blog/update-our-vehicle-lineup https://www.tesla.com/blog/update-our-vehicle-lineup

leesec 8y ago

>I'm not sure they've done things anyone considered impossible. Is this also a joke? They've been doing impossible stuff for literally 10 years, there's plenty examples of people claiming so. Consider this, there isn't a better car than the one they produced in 2012, and GM's best effort at an EV (the Bolt) lost somewhere between 4-8k per unit.