5 ms·

>This has nothing to with government interference. Local players in China are very strong Why are local players very strong? * Regulatory capture * Governmen

>This has nothing to with government interference. Local players in China are very strong Why are local players very strong? * Regulatory capture * Government promotion of internal services * IP theft from western countries How about, all of the above?

rat9988 7y ago
Can you explain how each point is in play in the current case?
chrischen 7y ago
Without providing sources or proof you’re just regurgitating highly anti-Chinese propaganda.
- parrellel 7y ago
  Since China is also known for all-levels number fudging and revisionism, and state policy and culture has a tendency toward brigading that'd make tumblr blush, the "anti-china propaganda" tends to be a tad more credible, no?
  - chrischen 7y ago
    Is that how the process works now? Go with whoever tends to be be a "tad more credible." Everyone has agendas, and you'll go nowhere comparing the relative strength of everyone's agendas. Simply stating something likely done by Alibaba, but not necessarily true not only adds nothing to the conversation, but detracts from the journey to the truth. If we accept his statement as is, then you may as well accept anything anti-China simply based on the fact that it is anti-China. But doing so of course would be openly declaring yourself as an agenda-based biased actor.
    - parrellel 7y ago
      Not anything, but well, China's a corrupt totalitarian state that believes in information control and revisionism... and then there's also the element of performative solidarity in response to state actions (re: doping scandals, trade sanctions, Taiwan, etc). So, I'll sing praises to China when they do something praiseworthy, but by god I'm not trusting a statistic or a press brief coming out of that place, and no-one else with half a brain should either.
      - nomnomray 7y ago
        Looking at the world like that is like plugging your ears and yelling "I can't hear you" whenever something goes against your preconceived narrative. For example, when China announces they have landed on the far side of the moon, how exactly does their totalitarian governance impact the accuracy of this press brief? Is it not more beneficial for your own sake to pass on judgment (or at least defer on your judgment) based on the particular event over what their goverment is like?
        parrellel 7y ago
        It isn't as if I'm ignoring what they put out. We're not in total jingoistic denial of reality territory here :) Regarding China's moon landing, their being a totalitarian government with a propagandistic focus matters a great deal. A lot of bad science has been foisted upon the world by similar regimes - look up Lamarckian inheritance in the USSR for instance if you haven't heard of it. In this case though, we've got pictures, we know the rocket launched, etc, etc.
  - SZJX 7y ago
    This and some of your other comments are some of the most ridiculous ones I've read out there. If somebody posted such a general blanket comment driven by ideology against the American gov without backing it up with any actual evidence or facts, they'd be butchered here. Get a grip.
    - parrellel 7y ago
      My two whole comments on the subject are truly beyond the pale... But more seriously, does China not engage in mass censorship and re-education camps? Do angry townsfolk not flash mob foreigners and beat them up? Last June was there not an expose on how massively Chinese provinces are misrepresenting the reality of their situations? Did their president not ban Winnie the Pooh? I've not said anything that hasn't been in the news.
      - chrischen 7y ago
        They may do all of those things... but honestly you wouldn't be the one to know or to be authoritative on such facts based on your attitude and painfully obvious bias.
        parrellel 7y ago
        They do do all these things though, they do them very publicly. Judging them based on that, based on those consistent and continued offenses informs that bias rather strongly. Edit: Here, lets put it this way. I don't trust the Chinese government, or anything tied to the Chinese government, because they've consistently lived down to my expectations. Read what they say, find out what actually happened, and eventually the default assumption HAS to change from "Trust but Verify" to just "Verify".

rat9988 7y ago

Can you explain how each point is in play in the current case?

chrischen 7y ago

Without providing sources or proof you’re just regurgitating highly anti-Chinese propaganda.

parrellel 7y ago
Since China is also known for all-levels number fudging and revisionism, and state policy and culture has a tendency toward brigading that'd make tumblr blush, the "anti-china propaganda" tends to be a tad more credible, no?
- chrischen 7y ago
  Is that how the process works now? Go with whoever tends to be be a "tad more credible." Everyone has agendas, and you'll go nowhere comparing the relative strength of everyone's agendas. Simply stating something likely done by Alibaba, but not necessarily true not only adds nothing to the conversation, but detracts from the journey to the truth. If we accept his statement as is, then you may as well accept anything anti-China simply based on the fact that it is anti-China. But doing so of course would be openly declaring yourself as an agenda-based biased actor.
  - parrellel 7y ago
    Not anything, but well, China's a corrupt totalitarian state that believes in information control and revisionism... and then there's also the element of performative solidarity in response to state actions (re: doping scandals, trade sanctions, Taiwan, etc). So, I'll sing praises to China when they do something praiseworthy, but by god I'm not trusting a statistic or a press brief coming out of that place, and no-one else with half a brain should either.
    - nomnomray 7y ago
      Looking at the world like that is like plugging your ears and yelling "I can't hear you" whenever something goes against your preconceived narrative. For example, when China announces they have landed on the far side of the moon, how exactly does their totalitarian governance impact the accuracy of this press brief? Is it not more beneficial for your own sake to pass on judgment (or at least defer on your judgment) based on the particular event over what their goverment is like?
      - parrellel 7y ago
        It isn't as if I'm ignoring what they put out. We're not in total jingoistic denial of reality territory here :) Regarding China's moon landing, their being a totalitarian government with a propagandistic focus matters a great deal. A lot of bad science has been foisted upon the world by similar regimes - look up Lamarckian inheritance in the USSR for instance if you haven't heard of it. In this case though, we've got pictures, we know the rocket launched, etc, etc.
- SZJX 7y ago
  This and some of your other comments are some of the most ridiculous ones I've read out there. If somebody posted such a general blanket comment driven by ideology against the American gov without backing it up with any actual evidence or facts, they'd be butchered here. Get a grip.
  - parrellel 7y ago
    My two whole comments on the subject are truly beyond the pale... But more seriously, does China not engage in mass censorship and re-education camps? Do angry townsfolk not flash mob foreigners and beat them up? Last June was there not an expose on how massively Chinese provinces are misrepresenting the reality of their situations? Did their president not ban Winnie the Pooh? I've not said anything that hasn't been in the news.
    - chrischen 7y ago
      They may do all of those things... but honestly you wouldn't be the one to know or to be authoritative on such facts based on your attitude and painfully obvious bias.
      - parrellel 7y ago
        They do do all these things though, they do them very publicly. Judging them based on that, based on those consistent and continued offenses informs that bias rather strongly. Edit: Here, lets put it this way. I don't trust the Chinese government, or anything tied to the Chinese government, because they've consistently lived down to my expectations. Read what they say, find out what actually happened, and eventually the default assumption HAS to change from "Trust but Verify" to just "Verify".