6 ms·

"Javascript Delenda Est", by zeveb, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11447851 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11447851 : > Can we please try to stop t

"Javascript Delenda Est", by zeveb, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11447851 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11447851 : > Can we please try to stop talking about this specific language ecosystem as an awful deplorable hell hole or whatever? Back in the second century BC, Cato the Elder ended his speeches with the phrase 'Carthago delenda est,' which is to say, 'Carthage must be destroyed.' It didn't matter what the ostensible topic of the speech was: above all, Carthage must be destroyed. My opinion towards JavaScript is much like Cato's towards Carthage: it must be rooted out, eliminated and destroyed entirely. I don't know if I'd go quite so far as to say that the fundamental challenge of mass computing is the final destruction of JavaScript — but I want to say it, even though it's false. JavaScript is a pox, a disaster, a shame. It is the most embarrassingly bad thing to become popular in computing since Windows 3.1. Its one virtue (that it's on every client device) is outshone by its plethora of flaws in much the same way that a matchstick is outshone by the sun, the stars and the primordial energy of the Big Bang added together. JavaScript is the XML, the Yugo, the Therac-25 of programming languages. The sheer amount of human effort which has been expended working around its fundamental flaws instead of advancing the development of mankind is astounding. The fact that people would take this paragon of wasted opportunity and use it on the server side, where there are so many better alternatives (to a first approximation, every other programming language ever used), is utterly appalling. JavaScript delenda est.

norswap 8y ago
How incredibly sad that this is the top comment at the time of writing.
- mabbo 8y ago
  That reflects the opinions of those who read and vote.
- artursapek 8y ago
  I mean, using javascript for server code is batshit insane.
  - quittersQuit 8y ago
    I quit my last job because some retarded morons were in love with node.js, and man were they some low-effort dipshits. They couldn't pay me enough to life a finger for them. It's like they couldn't understand certain facts about the universe, even if they wanted to. I'd get five sentences into a conversation with them, and lose all motivation to continue speaking. I'd just start smiling and nodding. I wish the world wasn't like this.
    - jdauriemma 8y ago
      > retarded morons > low-effort dipshits > they couldn't understand certain facts about the universe, even if they wanted to > I wish the world wasn't like this. Maybe "the world" isn't the problem in these interactions?
  - rhizome31 8y ago
    I had a quick go at Node.js and was surprised to find some interesting things. In particular I found the event model and the stream API rather nice. I have no idea how it's like to maintain a real-world code base though. Libraries seem to have very narrow scopes which means managing a lot of dependencies and that might be painful in the long run.
  - schwartzworld 8y ago
    Why?
- rhizome31 8y ago
  Given the lyrical emphasis deployed by the author, I feel this ought to be taken humorously.
JohnJamesRambo 8y ago
Why did Cato hate Carthage so much?
- c0vfefe 8y ago
  "The expression was a call to arms by the party advocating destruction of Rome's ancient rival Carthage, which was thought to be rebuilding its capacity for further warfare." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carthago_delenda_est https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carthago_delenda_est
- xeromal 8y ago
  Hannibal came from Carthage and Hannibal was Rome's public enemy number 1. Really though, it's always been about the Mediterranean. Whoever owed that owned the "global" economy at the time. Carthage threatened that.
dundercoder 8y ago
I feel nearly the same about the English language. It's my first language, and after learning French and Spanish, it's so clear that there's a better way.
- Kifot 8y ago
  out of curiosity, which features of English language do you find so annoying? My first guess would be inconsistence in pronunciation, but otherwise it seems quite logical and easy to learn
  - lazyhummingbird 8y ago
    In my experience, it's the lack of logical rules that many other languages follow that bothers people. Here are a few examples. Pronunciation - you make a fair point. In particular. Elision - other languages drop more unstressed sounds, allowing phrases to roll off the tongue more easily and smoothly. From Latin on, most romance languages have a healthy amount of elision. In Spanish, this chaining of words is referred to as enlace or encadenamiento. SVO - English relies on Subject-Verb-Object order to express what is being done by whom and to what. Compared to languages that use cases to do this, it can feel a bit tedious and disjointed. In general, case-based languages like Latin, do a good job of showing off what is happening given just a few words. Word order - beyond SVO, english relies on strange, rarely-codified rules of word order, making it hard for even native speakers to sound conversationally proficient. For example, the adjective rule is maddening: https://www.gingersoftware.com/content/grammar-rules/adjectives/order-of-adjectives/ https://www.gingersoftware.com/content/grammar-rules/adjecti... Unpredictable declensions and conjugations - "I go, I did go, I went, I have gone" is way crazier than languages that are more rules-based regarding how words are constructed. Borrows - I love how many words and phrases English has taken from other languages, but it loses internal cohesiveness due to its variety of external influences.

norswap 8y ago

How incredibly sad that this is the top comment at the time of writing.

mabbo 8y ago
That reflects the opinions of those who read and vote.
artursapek 8y ago
I mean, using javascript for server code is batshit insane.
- quittersQuit 8y ago
  I quit my last job because some retarded morons were in love with node.js, and man were they some low-effort dipshits. They couldn't pay me enough to life a finger for them. It's like they couldn't understand certain facts about the universe, even if they wanted to. I'd get five sentences into a conversation with them, and lose all motivation to continue speaking. I'd just start smiling and nodding. I wish the world wasn't like this.
  - jdauriemma 8y ago
    > retarded morons > low-effort dipshits > they couldn't understand certain facts about the universe, even if they wanted to > I wish the world wasn't like this. Maybe "the world" isn't the problem in these interactions?
- rhizome31 8y ago
  I had a quick go at Node.js and was surprised to find some interesting things. In particular I found the event model and the stream API rather nice. I have no idea how it's like to maintain a real-world code base though. Libraries seem to have very narrow scopes which means managing a lot of dependencies and that might be painful in the long run.
- schwartzworld 8y ago
  Why?
rhizome31 8y ago
Given the lyrical emphasis deployed by the author, I feel this ought to be taken humorously.

JohnJamesRambo 8y ago

Why did Cato hate Carthage so much?

c0vfefe 8y ago
"The expression was a call to arms by the party advocating destruction of Rome's ancient rival Carthage, which was thought to be rebuilding its capacity for further warfare." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carthago_delenda_est https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carthago_delenda_est
xeromal 8y ago
Hannibal came from Carthage and Hannibal was Rome's public enemy number 1. Really though, it's always been about the Mediterranean. Whoever owed that owned the "global" economy at the time. Carthage threatened that.

dundercoder 8y ago

I feel nearly the same about the English language. It's my first language, and after learning French and Spanish, it's so clear that there's a better way.

Kifot 8y ago
out of curiosity, which features of English language do you find so annoying? My first guess would be inconsistence in pronunciation, but otherwise it seems quite logical and easy to learn
- lazyhummingbird 8y ago
  In my experience, it's the lack of logical rules that many other languages follow that bothers people. Here are a few examples. Pronunciation - you make a fair point. In particular. Elision - other languages drop more unstressed sounds, allowing phrases to roll off the tongue more easily and smoothly. From Latin on, most romance languages have a healthy amount of elision. In Spanish, this chaining of words is referred to as enlace or encadenamiento. SVO - English relies on Subject-Verb-Object order to express what is being done by whom and to what. Compared to languages that use cases to do this, it can feel a bit tedious and disjointed. In general, case-based languages like Latin, do a good job of showing off what is happening given just a few words. Word order - beyond SVO, english relies on strange, rarely-codified rules of word order, making it hard for even native speakers to sound conversationally proficient. For example, the adjective rule is maddening: https://www.gingersoftware.com/content/grammar-rules/adjectives/order-of-adjectives/ https://www.gingersoftware.com/content/grammar-rules/adjecti... Unpredictable declensions and conjugations - "I go, I did go, I went, I have gone" is way crazier than languages that are more rules-based regarding how words are constructed. Borrows - I love how many words and phrases English has taken from other languages, but it loses internal cohesiveness due to its variety of external influences.