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I prefer to be able to choose whether my card details are updated. By default I do not want updates. I will definitely give Uber my new card, but I like how car

by Canada 8y ago

I prefer to be able to choose whether my card details are updated. By default I do not want updates. I will definitely give Uber my new card, but I like how card expiration kills subscriptions I don't care about without me having to do anything.

chrisan 8y ago
> but I like how card expiration kills subscriptions I don't care about without me having to do anything. I'm not advocating against choice of automatic updates... but shouldn't you come up with a different way to kill off subscriptions you don't care about? My VISA doesn't expire till 2023
- Canada 8y ago
  It's far from ideal, but I like the reset provided by card expiration. Better would be if the issuer provided a web interface to turn off any subscriptions at will. Asking the merchant to do it is usually very annoying and time consuming by design, so sometimes it just doesn't get done.
  - pbreit 8y ago
    No guarantee that your card issuer will decline a transaction on an expired card. Plus, that may not actually cancel the subscription and you could continue building a debt. Just cancel the sub.
    - literallycancer 8y ago
      I think he's talking about services that intentionally make it hard or impossible to cancel.
      - lordlimecat 8y ago
        This is overblown. Worst case, you can send a certified letter for most things. For gyms, it's pretty well known you either don't agree to said contract to begin with, or suck it up and show up in person if you did. And gyms have a valid contract and will likely continue accruing debt on your account which they could pursue if they wanted to.
- OrgNet 8y ago
  You can tell your credit card company that you lost your credit card if you need to change your credit card number. But usually, my bank tells me at least once a year that I need a new number because my card has been compromised. This is not ideal which is why whenever I can I setup autopay through my bank's website.
  - etatoby 8y ago
    > usually, my bank tells me at least once a year that I need a new number because my card has been compromised What!? I have been shopping online all over the place since the time Amazon was only a bookstore (read: decades ago) and this has never happened to me once. Are you sure nothing is wrong with your bank? Do you use your credit card in shady places?
    - OrgNet 8y ago
      The most shady places are probably gas stations/gas pumps and restaurants. They like to install card skimmers on gas pumps around here, maybe that is where it originates from. But most of the time, they cancel my card before any suspicious transactions are recorded.
      - joombaga 8y ago
        It's good to give those readers a tug. The skimmers aren't usually affixed well.
        OrgNet 8y ago
        I do that often and never found one... some can even be hidden inside the slot: https://www.geek.com/chips/this-card-skimmer-is-so-slim-it-was-hidden-inside-the-card-slot-1631018/ https://www.geek.com/chips/this-card-skimmer-is-so-slim-it-w...
    - kristianc 8y ago
      Unless by shady places you mean places like Target https://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/target-settles-2013-hacked-customer-data-breach-18-5-million-n764031 https://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/target-settle... Or Adobe https://krebsonsecurity.com/2013/10/adobe-to-announce-source-code-customer-data-breach/ https://krebsonsecurity.com/2013/10/adobe-to-announce-source... Or British Airways https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/sep/07/ba-british-airways-customers-hacked-credit-card-details-dark-web https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/sep/07/ba-british-... Credit card details get leaked or compromised all of the time and are a dime a dozen on the dark web.
ig1 8y ago
Don’t do this. Your card not working (generally speaking) doesn’t automatically end a contract. You could end up with the subscription not ending but just accruing as a debt, which the vendor could then sell on to a debt collector at a later point. If you just let a card expire you’re generally relying on the good will of the vendor to treat it as a cancellation.
- dboreham 8y ago
  But were put into this position by the bad will of the vendors who make it next to impossible to cancel the contract.
  - lordlimecat 8y ago
    Talk about hyperbole. What vendor contracts are next to impossible to cancel? And are we just talking about obnoxious phone calls with extended waits?
scarface74 8y ago
That’s just like people who are going to be “smart” and use a card with a low credit limit to attach to their hobby AWS accounts. Just because the charge was declined when you were billed doesn’t mean you don’t owe the money.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- robotastronaut 8y ago
  A subscription is a bit different as you pay in advance. If the charge fails, you generally lose access to the subscribed service. That's not the same as using an AWS resource, being invoiced for that use, then not paying it.
  - scarface74 8y ago
    That’s fair and in most cases, you can just update your card information and nothing is lost. But what if it is for a renewal of something like a domain name or backup service where you would lose data if you don’t renew?
misnome 8y ago
I did this deliberately. Tried to unsubscribe from the Times newspaper (digitally only) in the UK. - Unsubscribing was phone only - Limited operating hours - Long telephone queues And then they told me they would have to charge the next three months subscription, and that there was no technical way to remove me early. Surprisingly, when I cancelled the card and they didn’t get the money my account managed to get turned off somehow!
jtc331 8y ago
Issuing banks don’t have to fail a transaction just because the card is expired anyway, so this isn’t actually a guaranteed way to end the charges anyway. Of course issuing banks may even approve charges on a closed account too. In other words, relying on the bank to end payments has all kinds of failure modes.
redler 8y ago
There really ought to be an option to instruct a card company to do a "hard termination". Seems like a rule that would be right in the wheelhouse of the CFPB (in the US).

by Canada 8y ago

chrisan 8y ago

> but I like how card expiration kills subscriptions I don't care about without me having to do anything. I'm not advocating against choice of automatic updates... but shouldn't you come up with a different way to kill off subscriptions you don't care about? My VISA doesn't expire till 2023

Canada 8y ago
It's far from ideal, but I like the reset provided by card expiration. Better would be if the issuer provided a web interface to turn off any subscriptions at will. Asking the merchant to do it is usually very annoying and time consuming by design, so sometimes it just doesn't get done.
- pbreit 8y ago
  No guarantee that your card issuer will decline a transaction on an expired card. Plus, that may not actually cancel the subscription and you could continue building a debt. Just cancel the sub.
  - literallycancer 8y ago
    I think he's talking about services that intentionally make it hard or impossible to cancel.
    - lordlimecat 8y ago
      This is overblown. Worst case, you can send a certified letter for most things. For gyms, it's pretty well known you either don't agree to said contract to begin with, or suck it up and show up in person if you did. And gyms have a valid contract and will likely continue accruing debt on your account which they could pursue if they wanted to.
OrgNet 8y ago
You can tell your credit card company that you lost your credit card if you need to change your credit card number. But usually, my bank tells me at least once a year that I need a new number because my card has been compromised. This is not ideal which is why whenever I can I setup autopay through my bank's website.
- etatoby 8y ago
  > usually, my bank tells me at least once a year that I need a new number because my card has been compromised What!? I have been shopping online all over the place since the time Amazon was only a bookstore (read: decades ago) and this has never happened to me once. Are you sure nothing is wrong with your bank? Do you use your credit card in shady places?
  - OrgNet 8y ago
    The most shady places are probably gas stations/gas pumps and restaurants. They like to install card skimmers on gas pumps around here, maybe that is where it originates from. But most of the time, they cancel my card before any suspicious transactions are recorded.
    - joombaga 8y ago
      It's good to give those readers a tug. The skimmers aren't usually affixed well.
      - OrgNet 8y ago
        I do that often and never found one... some can even be hidden inside the slot: https://www.geek.com/chips/this-card-skimmer-is-so-slim-it-was-hidden-inside-the-card-slot-1631018/ https://www.geek.com/chips/this-card-skimmer-is-so-slim-it-w...
  - kristianc 8y ago
    Unless by shady places you mean places like Target https://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/target-settles-2013-hacked-customer-data-breach-18-5-million-n764031 https://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/target-settle... Or Adobe https://krebsonsecurity.com/2013/10/adobe-to-announce-source-code-customer-data-breach/ https://krebsonsecurity.com/2013/10/adobe-to-announce-source... Or British Airways https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/sep/07/ba-british-airways-customers-hacked-credit-card-details-dark-web https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/sep/07/ba-british-... Credit card details get leaked or compromised all of the time and are a dime a dozen on the dark web.

ig1 8y ago

Don’t do this. Your card not working (generally speaking) doesn’t automatically end a contract. You could end up with the subscription not ending but just accruing as a debt, which the vendor could then sell on to a debt collector at a later point. If you just let a card expire you’re generally relying on the good will of the vendor to treat it as a cancellation.

dboreham 8y ago
But were put into this position by the bad will of the vendors who make it next to impossible to cancel the contract.
- lordlimecat 8y ago
  Talk about hyperbole. What vendor contracts are next to impossible to cancel? And are we just talking about obnoxious phone calls with extended waits?

scarface74 8y ago

That’s just like people who are going to be “smart” and use a card with a low credit limit to attach to their hobby AWS accounts. Just because the charge was declined when you were billed doesn’t mean you don’t owe the money.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
robotastronaut 8y ago
A subscription is a bit different as you pay in advance. If the charge fails, you generally lose access to the subscribed service. That's not the same as using an AWS resource, being invoiced for that use, then not paying it.
- scarface74 8y ago
  That’s fair and in most cases, you can just update your card information and nothing is lost. But what if it is for a renewal of something like a domain name or backup service where you would lose data if you don’t renew?

misnome 8y ago

I did this deliberately. Tried to unsubscribe from the Times newspaper (digitally only) in the UK. - Unsubscribing was phone only - Limited operating hours - Long telephone queues And then they told me they would have to charge the next three months subscription, and that there was no technical way to remove me early. Surprisingly, when I cancelled the card and they didn’t get the money my account managed to get turned off somehow!

jtc331 8y ago

Issuing banks don’t have to fail a transaction just because the card is expired anyway, so this isn’t actually a guaranteed way to end the charges anyway. Of course issuing banks may even approve charges on a closed account too. In other words, relying on the bank to end payments has all kinds of failure modes.

redler 8y ago

There really ought to be an option to instruct a card company to do a "hard termination". Seems like a rule that would be right in the wheelhouse of the CFPB (in the US).