5 ms·

To what end? It was 30 years ago. The Eight Elders are all dead. You really think a bunch of westerners tutting at China about lowlights in their history will d

To what end? It was 30 years ago. The Eight Elders are all dead. You really think a bunch of westerners tutting at China about lowlights in their history will do anything other than galvanize Chinese nationalism?

vageli 8y ago
> To what end? It was 30 years ago. The Eight Elders are all dead. You really think a bunch of westerners tutting at China about lowlights in their history will do anything other than galvanize Chinese nationalism? This makes me wonder if discussions of reparations for slavery have fueled a similar fire in the United States. In my mind, criticism of past wrongs would lead to resentment by those criticized. I'm not in any way saying that discussing past harms has caused a resurgence of these issues, but I do wonder if there is some relationship.
abc-xyz 8y ago
It's important to speak up for as long as they seek to censor and imprison any person who dare to mention it, and use their economy to force foregn companies to help them censor/rewrite history. Staying silent, or defending their tantrums, is what allows the Chinese to make it impossible for Macs sold in China to display Taiwan's national flag, to justify Mariott firing an employee for liking a tweet thanking the company for listing certain countries on their website, to force Leica to remove their ad and issue an apology over nothing, etc.
- daodedickinson 8y ago
  What makes it possible to force Mariott to do that is China's ability to retaliate against LDS members in China. The LDS church itself voluntarily blocks access to their websites from China as well. It would take more than not "staying silent, or defending their tantrums" to change the status quo.
nercht12 8y ago
It needs to be talked about anyways. For every 100 nationals who laugh or scorn, 1 person hears about it and starts thinking "Hm... maybe what I've been taught here isn't so true. Maybe things really are bad here." We need information to make decisions. One side providing all the info leads to biased thoughts. It's exactly what's happening here in the US. People pick their news source (CNN, FOX, etc) and gradually become polarized to think one way. The lesson here is: Learn about the counter argument. You should find it isn't as crazy as people tell you.
- dethac 8y ago
  Thing is, for a majority of people, life in China is perfectly normal (other than maybe air quality and population density, but the Chinese government has tried hard to combat those issues). Most people are able to live normal lives where the government doesn't really have a massive influence. Even if it does, it's usually in terms of infrastructure development (transportation, housing, etc.), which can be done much more rapidly than in, say, the US (look at high-speed rail deployment in China over the past decade or so). Plus, what's the alternative? China would be trading their fast-paced economic expansion and massive infrastructure investments (necessary to keep pace with the expanding number of people in China) for more... freedom? And I think that's really the key here. The Chinese government is NOT incompetent and they're able to more than adequately provide for their citizens' needs. So, who would WANT a revolution?

vageli 8y ago

> To what end? It was 30 years ago. The Eight Elders are all dead. You really think a bunch of westerners tutting at China about lowlights in their history will do anything other than galvanize Chinese nationalism? This makes me wonder if discussions of reparations for slavery have fueled a similar fire in the United States. In my mind, criticism of past wrongs would lead to resentment by those criticized. I'm not in any way saying that discussing past harms has caused a resurgence of these issues, but I do wonder if there is some relationship.

abc-xyz 8y ago

It's important to speak up for as long as they seek to censor and imprison any person who dare to mention it, and use their economy to force foregn companies to help them censor/rewrite history. Staying silent, or defending their tantrums, is what allows the Chinese to make it impossible for Macs sold in China to display Taiwan's national flag, to justify Mariott firing an employee for liking a tweet thanking the company for listing certain countries on their website, to force Leica to remove their ad and issue an apology over nothing, etc.

daodedickinson 8y ago
What makes it possible to force Mariott to do that is China's ability to retaliate against LDS members in China. The LDS church itself voluntarily blocks access to their websites from China as well. It would take more than not "staying silent, or defending their tantrums" to change the status quo.

nercht12 8y ago

It needs to be talked about anyways. For every 100 nationals who laugh or scorn, 1 person hears about it and starts thinking "Hm... maybe what I've been taught here isn't so true. Maybe things really are bad here." We need information to make decisions. One side providing all the info leads to biased thoughts. It's exactly what's happening here in the US. People pick their news source (CNN, FOX, etc) and gradually become polarized to think one way. The lesson here is: Learn about the counter argument. You should find it isn't as crazy as people tell you.

dethac 8y ago
Thing is, for a majority of people, life in China is perfectly normal (other than maybe air quality and population density, but the Chinese government has tried hard to combat those issues). Most people are able to live normal lives where the government doesn't really have a massive influence. Even if it does, it's usually in terms of infrastructure development (transportation, housing, etc.), which can be done much more rapidly than in, say, the US (look at high-speed rail deployment in China over the past decade or so). Plus, what's the alternative? China would be trading their fast-paced economic expansion and massive infrastructure investments (necessary to keep pace with the expanding number of people in China) for more... freedom? And I think that's really the key here. The Chinese government is NOT incompetent and they're able to more than adequately provide for their citizens' needs. So, who would WANT a revolution?