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I suggest you take a but to watch https://youtu.be/PHe0bXAIuk0 https://youtu.be/PHe0bXAIuk0. Economics isn't so simple and only from the perspective of the buy

I suggest you take a but to watch https://youtu.be/PHe0bXAIuk0 https://youtu.be/PHe0bXAIuk0. Economics isn't so simple and only from the perspective of the buyer.

seibelj 8y ago
I have seen this video and it's well put together. But how does it advocate for reorganizing the economy to eliminate market principles, which is the entire debate we are having? Great video, but wholly irrelevant to this discussion.
- ddingus 8y ago
  There does not have to be a binary choice here. Markets do some things very well. They do not do everything well. The basic idea of self governance is we surrender some choice in order to maximize personal freedom. Applying market principles everywhere results in people being free to live under a bridge, or in an alleyway... We can and should very seriously constrain markets, and or eliminate them for some things. What is left will function much better because more people will be able to participate in a meaningful way. The left is moving this direction, adding economic reform to it's standard social agenda for these reasons. The party struggle over it is plain to see. Way too many people are in real economic trouble. Markets are killing them.
  - seibelj 8y ago
    The video has nothing to do with anything we are talking about, it is about short and longterm debt cycles. That was my comment. Markets aren't killing anybody, markets don't hold a gun. They are a tool to efficiently allocate resources via price discovery.
    - ddingus 8y ago
      Yes they are. They are a very poor tool in some use cases and are a great tool in others. Denying that is literally pulling triggers.
      - madez 8y ago
        No, denying that is at most failing to understand some connection. Attacking others doesn't help you make others understand the problems you are seeing.
        ddingus 8y ago
        None of that is an attack. It is a statement. I cannot, nor want to own how others take information like that. Ignorance takes many forms. Willful ignorance tends to be one of the more painful. Frame it all however you want to. Does not change the brutal impact we are seeing today. There is absolutely no reason to coddle, sugarcoat these things. If that is rough? Not my problem. It is our problem, and being brutally honest about it is the right thing to do.

I suggest you take a but to watch https://youtu.be/PHe0bXAIuk0 https://youtu.be/PHe0bXAIuk0. Economics isn't so simple and only from the perspective of the buyer.

seibelj 8y ago

I have seen this video and it's well put together. But how does it advocate for reorganizing the economy to eliminate market principles, which is the entire debate we are having? Great video, but wholly irrelevant to this discussion.

ddingus 8y ago
There does not have to be a binary choice here. Markets do some things very well. They do not do everything well. The basic idea of self governance is we surrender some choice in order to maximize personal freedom. Applying market principles everywhere results in people being free to live under a bridge, or in an alleyway... We can and should very seriously constrain markets, and or eliminate them for some things. What is left will function much better because more people will be able to participate in a meaningful way. The left is moving this direction, adding economic reform to it's standard social agenda for these reasons. The party struggle over it is plain to see. Way too many people are in real economic trouble. Markets are killing them.
- seibelj 8y ago
  The video has nothing to do with anything we are talking about, it is about short and longterm debt cycles. That was my comment. Markets aren't killing anybody, markets don't hold a gun. They are a tool to efficiently allocate resources via price discovery.
  - ddingus 8y ago
    Yes they are. They are a very poor tool in some use cases and are a great tool in others. Denying that is literally pulling triggers.
    - madez 8y ago
      No, denying that is at most failing to understand some connection. Attacking others doesn't help you make others understand the problems you are seeing.
      - ddingus 8y ago
        None of that is an attack. It is a statement. I cannot, nor want to own how others take information like that. Ignorance takes many forms. Willful ignorance tends to be one of the more painful. Frame it all however you want to. Does not change the brutal impact we are seeing today. There is absolutely no reason to coddle, sugarcoat these things. If that is rough? Not my problem. It is our problem, and being brutally honest about it is the right thing to do.