U2 + Eno + Langlois. And Radiohead + Godrich. And Nirvana + Butch Vig. Producer is part of the band in the 1980's and 1990's, since the 2000's the 'producer is

U2 + Eno + Langlois. And Radiohead + Godrich. And Nirvana + Butch Vig. Producer is part of the band in the 1980's and 1990's, since the 2000's the 'producer is the band'. Katy Perry et. al. just sing Max Martin covers. The musicians don't have at their disposal the tools to make the soundscape, unless they practice for 10 years and actually 'get good', in which case they might be 'mini famous' and respected among some niches.