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I do IT orders in a research institute, a MBP user wants a big memory machine to do server side data analysis, and wants to order the iMac pro 128 GB ram. He’s

I do IT orders in a research institute, a MBP user wants a big memory machine to do server side data analysis, and wants to order the iMac pro 128 GB ram. He’s shocked to learn that for the same price he can get a Dell Epyc server with 512 GB ram. Guess what he still wants? The iMac, for the “ecosystem”.

danieldk 8y ago
I think that people underestimate the cost for most people to switch to another system. If you use any system for years, there are many ingrained habits that are hard to unlearn. Then there are probably applications that they use that have no direct replacements on Windows or Linux (e.g. OmniGraffle). Sure, there may be applications within the same class (diagramming), but even if they are as polished, it takes time to become as productive in a replacement. Most people who are not tech enthusiasts just want things to stay as they know them. For a normal user, switching to another OS and applications is like switching from QWERTY to Dvorak - a long, tedious process, that will reduce productivity for one or two years. Somewhat ironically, using a unix-variant is the easiest way to stick to what you know. Windows and to some extend macOS has gone through some design fads. Apple ditches/replaces fully functional programs, such as Quicktime 7, Aperture, and iWork (it took many years to get linked text boxes back). Whereas on a unix, you can still work like it is 1979 if you want to.
- w0utert 8y ago
  >> I think that people underestimate the cost for most people to switch to another system. I've been using all three major OS-es extensively for years, so for me switching wouldn't actually be that much of a problem. The simple fact of the matter is that I prefer macOS for almost anything, by far. No lock-in required. Like someone above me already posted, I also fully agree Apple has seriously messed up with these keyboards, and in general appears to have a major problem with their design priorities (both in hardware and software). But that doesn't mean their platform isn't great (for me, even the best available) for many use-cases. If you forget about keyboard problems, high price, and for some (very narrow subset of) use cases insufficient specs.
culturestate 8y ago
The other commenter makes good points re: the cognitive cost of switching platforms, but let me give you another point of view: the Apple ecosystem is, actually, shockingly good. My Apple Watch unlocks all of my Macs. When I join a new WiFi network on my iPhone, those credentials are immediately available to my iPad. When my iPhone rings, it pauses video playing on my Apple TV until I ignore the call. To send a link from my iPad to a friend on WhatsApp, I can copy the link on my iPad and paste it into WhatsApp on my iPhone - automatically. I can use my iPhone as a remote camera to insert a photo into a Notes document on my Mac with one action. The list goes on. Yes, there are absolutely problems and Apple has made some dumb choices (I don't mind the butterfly keyboards but I hate the razor-sharp palmrests...), but overall it's incredibly cohesive in a way that I feel lots of people don't really grasp.
- barrystaes 8y ago
  > When my iPhone rings, it pauses video playing on my Apple TV until I ignore the call. To send a link from my iPad to a friend on WhatsApp, I can copy the link on my iPad and paste it into WhatsApp on my iPhone - automatically. I get what you appreciate, but its not for everyone. I like my tools smart but still 100% predictive by me. Like one device erasing the clipboard of another device.
  - culturestate 8y ago
    > I get what you appreciate, but its not for everyone I know you didn't mean it this way, but for illustrative purposes this is precisely the kind of reasoning people use to downplay the value of an ecosystem, whether it's Apple or Google or (eventually, I assume) Samsung. "I don't want this, therefore it's not a valuable thing." Of course no product will be (or should be) the be-all, end-all solution for everyone in the world. The fact that it isn't shouldn't be a mark against it or against the people who choose it, though. Come to think of it, this is applicable to a huge number of products and strategies in our industry.
- threeseed 8y ago
  Let me add a few more: 1) SMS/iMessages synced across all devices and able to send from any of the devices e.g. Mac or non-4G iPad. 2) 2FA codes received on your iPhone are automatically populated in Safari text fields on your Mac. 3) Safari window opened on an iPhone will appear as an icon on the Mac so you can easily pick up where you left off. Works for a number of other apps as well. And in every direction. 4) AirDrop is really great for quick, adhoc file transfers.
inflatableDodo 8y ago
Should have told them to buy an old Apple Pro tower and max it out with new kit. This way you can actually make a machine more powerful than the ones that they currently sell.
- markonen 8y ago
  Depends on what your definition of "powerful" is. If it has to do with CPU or RAM or SSD performance then no, you cannot max out the 2012 vintage Mac Pro with kit comparable to what the current iMac Pro ships with.
  - inflatableDodo 8y ago
    Ability to play back 8K video? https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/8xkq8k/mac-pro-upgrade-community https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/8xkq8k/mac-pro-up...
fredsir 8y ago
It just shows that there is more to computers than their specifications. Doesn't matter how much RAM is has got if I don't like using it.
johnchristopher 8y ago
I assumed that by "eco-system" those people think of default icons and wallpapers ?

danieldk 8y ago

I think that people underestimate the cost for most people to switch to another system. If you use any system for years, there are many ingrained habits that are hard to unlearn. Then there are probably applications that they use that have no direct replacements on Windows or Linux (e.g. OmniGraffle). Sure, there may be applications within the same class (diagramming), but even if they are as polished, it takes time to become as productive in a replacement. Most people who are not tech enthusiasts just want things to stay as they know them. For a normal user, switching to another OS and applications is like switching from QWERTY to Dvorak - a long, tedious process, that will reduce productivity for one or two years. Somewhat ironically, using a unix-variant is the easiest way to stick to what you know. Windows and to some extend macOS has gone through some design fads. Apple ditches/replaces fully functional programs, such as Quicktime 7, Aperture, and iWork (it took many years to get linked text boxes back). Whereas on a unix, you can still work like it is 1979 if you want to.

w0utert 8y ago
>> I think that people underestimate the cost for most people to switch to another system. I've been using all three major OS-es extensively for years, so for me switching wouldn't actually be that much of a problem. The simple fact of the matter is that I prefer macOS for almost anything, by far. No lock-in required. Like someone above me already posted, I also fully agree Apple has seriously messed up with these keyboards, and in general appears to have a major problem with their design priorities (both in hardware and software). But that doesn't mean their platform isn't great (for me, even the best available) for many use-cases. If you forget about keyboard problems, high price, and for some (very narrow subset of) use cases insufficient specs.

culturestate 8y ago

The other commenter makes good points re: the cognitive cost of switching platforms, but let me give you another point of view: the Apple ecosystem is, actually, shockingly good. My Apple Watch unlocks all of my Macs. When I join a new WiFi network on my iPhone, those credentials are immediately available to my iPad. When my iPhone rings, it pauses video playing on my Apple TV until I ignore the call. To send a link from my iPad to a friend on WhatsApp, I can copy the link on my iPad and paste it into WhatsApp on my iPhone - automatically. I can use my iPhone as a remote camera to insert a photo into a Notes document on my Mac with one action. The list goes on. Yes, there are absolutely problems and Apple has made some dumb choices (I don't mind the butterfly keyboards but I hate the razor-sharp palmrests...), but overall it's incredibly cohesive in a way that I feel lots of people don't really grasp.

barrystaes 8y ago
> When my iPhone rings, it pauses video playing on my Apple TV until I ignore the call. To send a link from my iPad to a friend on WhatsApp, I can copy the link on my iPad and paste it into WhatsApp on my iPhone - automatically. I get what you appreciate, but its not for everyone. I like my tools smart but still 100% predictive by me. Like one device erasing the clipboard of another device.
- culturestate 8y ago
  > I get what you appreciate, but its not for everyone I know you didn't mean it this way, but for illustrative purposes this is precisely the kind of reasoning people use to downplay the value of an ecosystem, whether it's Apple or Google or (eventually, I assume) Samsung. "I don't want this, therefore it's not a valuable thing." Of course no product will be (or should be) the be-all, end-all solution for everyone in the world. The fact that it isn't shouldn't be a mark against it or against the people who choose it, though. Come to think of it, this is applicable to a huge number of products and strategies in our industry.
threeseed 8y ago
Let me add a few more: 1) SMS/iMessages synced across all devices and able to send from any of the devices e.g. Mac or non-4G iPad. 2) 2FA codes received on your iPhone are automatically populated in Safari text fields on your Mac. 3) Safari window opened on an iPhone will appear as an icon on the Mac so you can easily pick up where you left off. Works for a number of other apps as well. And in every direction. 4) AirDrop is really great for quick, adhoc file transfers.

inflatableDodo 8y ago

Should have told them to buy an old Apple Pro tower and max it out with new kit. This way you can actually make a machine more powerful than the ones that they currently sell.

markonen 8y ago
Depends on what your definition of "powerful" is. If it has to do with CPU or RAM or SSD performance then no, you cannot max out the 2012 vintage Mac Pro with kit comparable to what the current iMac Pro ships with.
- inflatableDodo 8y ago
  Ability to play back 8K video? https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/8xkq8k/mac-pro-upgrade-community https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/8xkq8k/mac-pro-up...

fredsir 8y ago

It just shows that there is more to computers than their specifications. Doesn't matter how much RAM is has got if I don't like using it.

johnchristopher 8y ago

I assumed that by "eco-system" those people think of default icons and wallpapers ?