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Presumably, except at the boundary conditions, an increase in the number of applications per student comes with a corresponding decrease in the percentage of ac

by kd5bjo 8y ago

Presumably, except at the boundary conditions, an increase in the number of applications per student comes with a corresponding decrease in the percentage of accepted applications that result in a student actually showing up to the university— in the end every student still picks only one to actually attend. These should mostly cancel out and keep the university’s acceptance rate (offers extended per application received) about the same.

ThrustVectoring 8y ago
This is only true if you ignore the average rank preference of the school among applicants. Better-ranked college won't see as much decline in acceptance percentage, while worse-ranked colleges will see more than the expected decline. Some of the ways colleges can combat this on their own is by trying to jump the rest of the system through early admission (that creeps earlier and earlier over time), or by giving out exploding offers (I don't think this is nearly as common). The solution is to go to a deferred-acceptance algorithm such as Gale-Shapley. It's a relatively minor change, adding a third party that matches students to colleges algorithmically. The students send in a rank-ordering of the colleges they wish to attend, and colleges send in a rank-ordering of which students they'd prefer to admit (along with quantity). The students get their most-preferred college that likes them enough to admit them over others, and the colleges run zero risk of sending out too many offers.
busyant 8y ago
>These should mostly cancel out and keep the university’s acceptance rate (offers extended per application received) about the same. I agree w/ your argument, but there are probably other factors that have changed w/ college applications. The article seems to disagree w/ my point below, but from my anecdotal vantagepoint, I think there is a kernel of truth to my opinion: I see many 2nd and 3rd tier schools near me (I'm in the eastern US) opening themselves up to foreign undergrads. I don't know the reason for this, but my suspicion is that these schools need to stave off the onslaught from entities like Coursera and edX. As such, they are trawling from bodies, wherever they can get them. I've met numerous foreign undergrads who can barely speak English and my thought is usually "How could the University of _______ accept you in good conscience and move you toward graduation when you can't even understand your lecturers?" e.g., I taught a class at a local university a few years ago. Class saw an influx of students from 1 particular country over a few years. Most of the foreign students from this country could barely speak English and it was obvious from "pop" quizzes that they didn't understand the material (which is understandable if you can't understand the language). They all tried to cheat on the exams (using a remarkably elaborate scheme). Eventually, I figured it out and I failed them. The mastermind emailed me and said that he knew he did not deserve to pass, but if he failed he would need an additional semester to complete his engineering degree.[1] IMO, the university behaved unethically by admitting these students into a system that they are not equipped to legitimately succeed in. Anyway, I assume that if you increase your applicant pool from outside the US, the acceptance rates will drop--at least for a little while. I know that's not the only reason for the drop, but it might be part of the issue. [1] After that, I stopped getting students from that country in my class.
- kaitai 8y ago
  It's not Coursera and EdX. It's that foreign students pay full price. As administrative costs increase and infrastructure costs increase and state contributions decrease if there ever were any, the money needs to come from somewhere.
  - busyant 8y ago
    Good point. Thank you.
  - fhbdukfrh 8y ago
    Specific programs also tend to set their own prices. Even in Canada with all public schools tuition for business, medical, veterinary, etc. Are all higher
bluGill 8y ago
It isn't that easy for a university. There is always the danger that more students accept their offer then expected and your classrooms are not big enough for the larger class. There are enough universities around that statistically we can expect if they all just increased their offers made rate some would get too many students attending the next fall every year.

by kd5bjo 8y ago

ThrustVectoring 8y ago

This is only true if you ignore the average rank preference of the school among applicants. Better-ranked college won't see as much decline in acceptance percentage, while worse-ranked colleges will see more than the expected decline. Some of the ways colleges can combat this on their own is by trying to jump the rest of the system through early admission (that creeps earlier and earlier over time), or by giving out exploding offers (I don't think this is nearly as common). The solution is to go to a deferred-acceptance algorithm such as Gale-Shapley. It's a relatively minor change, adding a third party that matches students to colleges algorithmically. The students send in a rank-ordering of the colleges they wish to attend, and colleges send in a rank-ordering of which students they'd prefer to admit (along with quantity). The students get their most-preferred college that likes them enough to admit them over others, and the colleges run zero risk of sending out too many offers.

busyant 8y ago

>These should mostly cancel out and keep the university’s acceptance rate (offers extended per application received) about the same. I agree w/ your argument, but there are probably other factors that have changed w/ college applications. The article seems to disagree w/ my point below, but from my anecdotal vantagepoint, I think there is a kernel of truth to my opinion: I see many 2nd and 3rd tier schools near me (I'm in the eastern US) opening themselves up to foreign undergrads. I don't know the reason for this, but my suspicion is that these schools need to stave off the onslaught from entities like Coursera and edX. As such, they are trawling from bodies, wherever they can get them. I've met numerous foreign undergrads who can barely speak English and my thought is usually "How could the University of _______ accept you in good conscience and move you toward graduation when you can't even understand your lecturers?" e.g., I taught a class at a local university a few years ago. Class saw an influx of students from 1 particular country over a few years. Most of the foreign students from this country could barely speak English and it was obvious from "pop" quizzes that they didn't understand the material (which is understandable if you can't understand the language). They all tried to cheat on the exams (using a remarkably elaborate scheme). Eventually, I figured it out and I failed them. The mastermind emailed me and said that he knew he did not deserve to pass, but if he failed he would need an additional semester to complete his engineering degree.[1] IMO, the university behaved unethically by admitting these students into a system that they are not equipped to legitimately succeed in. Anyway, I assume that if you increase your applicant pool from outside the US, the acceptance rates will drop--at least for a little while. I know that's not the only reason for the drop, but it might be part of the issue. [1] After that, I stopped getting students from that country in my class.

kaitai 8y ago
It's not Coursera and EdX. It's that foreign students pay full price. As administrative costs increase and infrastructure costs increase and state contributions decrease if there ever were any, the money needs to come from somewhere.
- busyant 8y ago
  Good point. Thank you.
- fhbdukfrh 8y ago
  Specific programs also tend to set their own prices. Even in Canada with all public schools tuition for business, medical, veterinary, etc. Are all higher

bluGill 8y ago

It isn't that easy for a university. There is always the danger that more students accept their offer then expected and your classrooms are not big enough for the larger class. There are enough universities around that statistically we can expect if they all just increased their offers made rate some would get too many students attending the next fall every year.