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I wonder to what extent MOOCs have contributed to this crisis. It used to be that to get advanced training of any kind - credentialed or not - you had to go to

I wonder to what extent MOOCs have contributed to this crisis. It used to be that to get advanced training of any kind - credentialed or not - you had to go to university, and this helped a lot of subpar universities survive. Now for advanced training it is becoming easier and easier to go online and those programs benefit from scale (you can have classes of 10K people, etc.) That to me would put a crunch on middle or lower tier institutions, which rely heavily on teaching and which don't offer a degree worth much more than an online credential. In that scenario, you would expect these schools to go for the short term "survival" scenario vs. the long term "thrive" scenario, and in fact, that is what we see - lower tier schools with big sports budgets, fancy gyms, nice cafeterias, etc., staffed entirely by adjunct faculty. Overall, the selective pressure against these lower tier universities might not be a bad thing. As those die out (which I believe they will), it could result in a good set of schools all which provide a strong, general education, and an equal, respected set of online institutions which can provide credentials for those who do not want the more traditional path.

blueboo 8y ago
> advanced training of any kind - credentialed or not - you had to go to university not true. from music, to plumbing, to software, to fiction writing... meanwhile the training MOOCs provide is hardly equivalent to a bachelor's degree in CV-terms let alone curriculum. Meanwhile, for example, a Data Science in Python nanodegree may very well be better prep for an industry job than a statistics bachelor's, but the two were never going to be equivalent.
- maze-le 8y ago
  >> Meanwhile, for example, a Data Science in Python nanodegree may very well be better prep for an industry job That is the root of the problem isn't it? IMO No institution should train you for a job in the industry except the industry. Also, higher education (post-college) should not discredit themself to be an apprentices-program for any industry -- it is not what they can accomplish anyhow since the requirements change faster than the institutions can adapt. A university has lost all of its meaning if they do not work to further the field itself, but for the ever-changing demands of the economy.
exelius 8y ago
Not at all. The discovery problem is too hard. College degrees from elite schools only work because they’re elite and people can remember a small number of “good” schools relatively consistently. If I want to hire someone, how can I tell the good schools / MOOCs from the bad? Will I be able to continue doing that reliably over time? Will it be any better a signal as to who is a good candidate than the current system? As they are, most for-profit MOOCs seem to have pivoted to being corporate training / collaboration platforms...
- maze-le 8y ago
  >> If I want to hire someone, how can I tell the good schools / MOOCs from the bad? You probably shouldn't. If you want to hire someone, test their skillset on a small-ish 1-week Project with realistic goals and expectations. Optionally with integration in a team, since soft-skills are not really teachable but usually very important to solve problems on a certain level.

blueboo 8y ago

> advanced training of any kind - credentialed or not - you had to go to university not true. from music, to plumbing, to software, to fiction writing... meanwhile the training MOOCs provide is hardly equivalent to a bachelor's degree in CV-terms let alone curriculum. Meanwhile, for example, a Data Science in Python nanodegree may very well be better prep for an industry job than a statistics bachelor's, but the two were never going to be equivalent.

maze-le 8y ago
>> Meanwhile, for example, a Data Science in Python nanodegree may very well be better prep for an industry job That is the root of the problem isn't it? IMO No institution should train you for a job in the industry except the industry. Also, higher education (post-college) should not discredit themself to be an apprentices-program for any industry -- it is not what they can accomplish anyhow since the requirements change faster than the institutions can adapt. A university has lost all of its meaning if they do not work to further the field itself, but for the ever-changing demands of the economy.

exelius 8y ago

Not at all. The discovery problem is too hard. College degrees from elite schools only work because they’re elite and people can remember a small number of “good” schools relatively consistently. If I want to hire someone, how can I tell the good schools / MOOCs from the bad? Will I be able to continue doing that reliably over time? Will it be any better a signal as to who is a good candidate than the current system? As they are, most for-profit MOOCs seem to have pivoted to being corporate training / collaboration platforms...

maze-le 8y ago
>> If I want to hire someone, how can I tell the good schools / MOOCs from the bad? You probably shouldn't. If you want to hire someone, test their skillset on a small-ish 1-week Project with realistic goals and expectations. Optionally with integration in a team, since soft-skills are not really teachable but usually very important to solve problems on a certain level.