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The thing that shocks me is that people seem to describe so many of these incidents, yet they just seem to have passed by with little fallout. At least none was
by JonnieCache 16y ago
The thing that shocks me is that people seem to describe so many of these incidents, yet they just seem to have passed by with little fallout. At least none was described in the article.
In most circles of independent minded, proactive people (like those in the OSS scene) that I have moved in, such blatant acts of sexual assault would lead to a massive commotion, probably violence. How can you walk up behind a stranger in a public place full of your peers, grab them on the ass and proposition them for sex without getting something broken over your head, or at the very least being shouted and screamed at?
Sounds like people need to be more willing to stand up for themselves and their friends, to more clearly establish group norms of what is and isnt acceptable.
Articles like this are very depressing to me as a young idealistic developer who sees the open source world as a progressive and egalitarian model for how to live our lives.
- Tichy 16y ago"without getting something broken over your head" What is the point of getting into a potentially life-threatening situation just to teach a jerk a lesson? As for less drastic responses, I agree that the best way to enlighten people would probably be when caught in the act. It seems unlikely that "photograph upskirt guy" is reading this article and just now it dawns on him "maybe I shouldn't have been doing that".
- JonnieCache 16y agoI'm not advocating breaking things over peoples heads. I'm saying that I'm shocked that the heads of said upskirt photographers havent been used to break anything yet. It shows a level of restraint that is certainly morally commendable, whether it has benefitted the community long term I am not so sure. > What is the point of getting into a potentially life-threatening situation just to teach a jerk a lesson? What is the point of getting into a potentially life-threatening situation just to be on the other side of a street? Your question is tautological.
- Tichy 16y agoCracking a bottle over someones head could escalate (and land you in jail anyway).
- hugh3 16y agoI know I'm at the risk of taking an offhand turn of phrase too literally here, but just in case anyone is ever tempted to break a bottle over someone's head like they do in the movies: don't. Glass bottles are surprisingly strong, and breaking one over a slightly springy surface like someone's head requires a very forceful blow which could cause serious injuries. And that's before we get to the broken-glass-going-everywhere problem. If you do ever need to deal appropriately with some pervert taking upskirt photos, I recommend putting him in a headlock and getting a couple of other guys to help you wrestle him to the ground, where they can hold him down while you lecture him on the subject of good manners and appropriate behaviour.
- sliverstorm 16y agoBreaking glass bottles over heads mostly happens in old westerns and that sort of thing. Is it possible glass bottles of the time were more fragile? In other news, I love the image of a cordial lecture on good manners and being polite to women directed towards a guy in a headlock on the ground beneath me. Hopefully I'll have the guts to do it if needed.
- follower 16y ago> Sounds like people need to be more willing to stand up for themselves and their friends Potentially "being different" in addition to standing up and out can be a daunting prospect. There's a lot of perceived social risk in such situations.
- JonnieCache 16y ago>Potentially "being different" in addition to standing up and out can be a daunting prospect. This is laughable considering how much talk there is in the hacker world of defying convention, challenging conventional wisdom, standing out from the crowd, changing the world and associated platitudes.
- follower 16y agoMaybe you're a lot more confident in social situations than I am then. :) I don't think the hacker community is any more welcoming of dissenting opinions than the world at large. Standing out is a good way to get flamed. Or be told that one's opinion is "laughable". :)
- JoachimSchipper 16y agoTalk is cheap, though.
- jdp23 16y agoThere's a lot of talk about this in the hacker world. The reality is that some kinds of "different" are seen as just fine, and others have major social consequences. If you're a guy, try wearing hot pink jeans and shoes, a lavender femme-looking unisex top, and nail polish to a tech conference and see how the other guys react. It's eye-opening.
- JonnieCache 16y agoNobody is going to react well to hot pink jeans, regardless of their genital category.