5 ms·

Facebook is enhancing my family’s joy. My family is spread across the world. Because of Facebook, I know what my sister in law is up to, and have things to ta

by blhack 7y ago

Facebook is enhancing my family’s joy. My family is spread across the world. Because of Facebook, I know what my sister in law is up to, and have things to talk about with her when I see her. I know what my nieces do over the summer at the cabin, and have a connection to them. These hit pieces are ridiculous. If you don’t like Facebook, don’t use it.

Nextgrid 7y ago
> If you don’t like Facebook, don’t use it. I don't use it. It doesn't prevent them from using me anyway though. They're happy asking my friends for their contacts list (so they can get my phone number) and setting cookies through their "Like" buttons embedded everywhere without ever asking for my permission. The only way to stop that company is to kill it, and these "ridiculous" pieces might very well be the only solution (technical people have been sounding the alarm for ages and nothing happened, so maybe something will happen when a mainstream publication decides to attack them).
- mises 7y ago
  So use an ad blocker. It's about thirty seconds to set up, and very user-friendly. Even with the default lists, they do a great job. The reason I take issue is the word you used above: "attack". I think its use is telling. The New York Times has broken newsworthy information that was against Facebook, which I think is their job and a good thing to do. Newspapers, however, aren't really supposed to "attack" things. This is part of the reason there is such distrust in the media; many news publications are indeed attacking various things and not even trying to hide it.
  - Nextgrid 7y ago
    So following your logic the solution to knife crime would be to tell everyone to wear armor instead of putting the criminals in jail? > Newspapers, however, aren't really supposed to "attack" things I would consider it an attack if they were publishing lies. But I don't see any lies here - Facebook has dug their own grave and is now rightfully getting what they deserve.
    - ThomPete 7y ago
      Is Facebook comitting a crime? Not sure i understand your analogy.
      - Nextgrid 7y ago
        Facebook is actually trying to fight a fine from Belgium's privacy regulator, so they definitely committed a crime, at least there: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jun/15/belgium-facebook-court-privacy-breaches-ads https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jun/15/belgium-f... My analogy was that it shouldn't be up to me to defend myself from someone else's nefarious actions. I should not have to install ad blockers to avoid getting stalked by Facebook.
        ThomPete 7y ago
        But you havent explained the crime yet.
  - username223 7y ago
    > So use an ad blocker. It's about thirty seconds to set up, and very user-friendly. Even with the default lists, they do a great job. Have you ever tried to set up ad/tracker blocking for a non-tech person? If it actually protects their privacy, then it's also a huge pain in the ass that randomly breaks things and requires constant attention. DNS- or IP-level blocking works best, but requires constant maintenance. Then there are the various caches. What breaks when you block "*.googleapis.com"? Then there's the question of which user-hostile JavaScript APIs you try to block. WebGL? WebUSB? And from whom? It's endless war.
- ThomPete 7y ago
  In what way are you being used by FB in ways that it affect you physically. Sounds like its more in principle you are complaining?
  - Nextgrid 7y ago
    The data they are collecting about me & my friends is a growing liability. It's a goldmine of highly personal data that can be used for malicious purposes when it finally leaks. They are putting me at risk in order to grow their cancerous business, but when shit hits the fan I will be the one dealing with the consequences, not them (they will just issue their fake apology as usual and carry on).
    - ThomPete 7y ago
      But you haven't given a concrete example of you being actually affected by this so I will assume it's more an on principle argument rather than you actually pointing to any wrongdoing. Your ISP tracks you, Ycombinator tracks you, every site out there that have cookies track you. Everyone can potentially missuse that data they don't have to be Facebook for that.
      - Nextgrid 7y ago
        Would you feel comfortable with someone following you around 24/7 and taking pictures of you? Technically this would be legal - you have no right to privacy on public property. My ISP should not be tracking me (I’m sure some of them are scummy enough to do so anyway). Ycombinator does not track me outside of their own website. Everyone does not have stupid “like” buttons scattered across the entire web for the sole purpose of tracking people outside of their own website.
        ThomPete 7y ago
        You dont need a like button to track someone. Of course your isp tracks you to see if you download copyrighted content. Your outrage is pretty selective all based on a non concrete potential threat which exist with everything from google to your phone to ycombinator to google analytics. Give me a concrete missuse, not just specualtions based on selctively who you like or dont.
- basch 7y ago
  So you blame fb, instead of your friends, for your friends handing over your phone number to an advertising company? It might make sense to stop giving your phone number out to your friends. At some point, lets say you have 100 friends, and ONE gives out your number. That's it, its out there. Your phone number is either de facto public information, or you cant really give it out to anybody, except maybe banks for verification.
  - y4mi 7y ago
    Facebook doesn't limit itself to phone numbers. They're just a convenient data point to pin everything else they've gathered to your name. And the thing people take offense in isn't the phone number directory... It's everything else that they not only know about, but also sell to unrelated third parties.
    - basch 7y ago
      Third parties like who?
  - Nextgrid 7y ago
    When a crazy sociopath manipulates my friends in order to achieve what he wants I’d blame the sociopath and not my friends. If you’re not tech-savvy and don’t know anything about Facebook it’s reasonable to think they will actually keep those contacts private and only use them for what they said they would (aka recommend you people that are in your contacts but you haven’t yet added on FB). Also I don’t have a problem with one friend accidentally giving away my number to one bad guy. I have a problem with a toxic company using that phone number to build a graph of my relationships and my friends’.
    - basch 7y ago
      So you have a problem with them using the contacts in the literal way they said they would, to build a graph to suggest friends to people. Seems like being mad you got bacon from a bacon salesman, screaming that you were told it would be pork.
coding123 7y ago
Wouldn't it have been more fun to talk to them on the phone about that stuff?
- birksherty 7y ago
  That's what I do. I find it much better to not knowing everything about my family and friends all the time. So I talk over phone and we talk for hours. After ending the call I feel happy. I never feel like that using social media. When we meet physically, there are so much to talk about and share.
overcast 7y ago
At what cost?
- blhack 7y ago
  $0.00?

by blhack 7y ago

Nextgrid 7y ago

> If you don’t like Facebook, don’t use it. I don't use it. It doesn't prevent them from using me anyway though. They're happy asking my friends for their contacts list (so they can get my phone number) and setting cookies through their "Like" buttons embedded everywhere without ever asking for my permission. The only way to stop that company is to kill it, and these "ridiculous" pieces might very well be the only solution (technical people have been sounding the alarm for ages and nothing happened, so maybe something will happen when a mainstream publication decides to attack them).

mises 7y ago
So use an ad blocker. It's about thirty seconds to set up, and very user-friendly. Even with the default lists, they do a great job. The reason I take issue is the word you used above: "attack". I think its use is telling. The New York Times has broken newsworthy information that was against Facebook, which I think is their job and a good thing to do. Newspapers, however, aren't really supposed to "attack" things. This is part of the reason there is such distrust in the media; many news publications are indeed attacking various things and not even trying to hide it.
- Nextgrid 7y ago
  So following your logic the solution to knife crime would be to tell everyone to wear armor instead of putting the criminals in jail? > Newspapers, however, aren't really supposed to "attack" things I would consider it an attack if they were publishing lies. But I don't see any lies here - Facebook has dug their own grave and is now rightfully getting what they deserve.
  - ThomPete 7y ago
    Is Facebook comitting a crime? Not sure i understand your analogy.
    - Nextgrid 7y ago
      Facebook is actually trying to fight a fine from Belgium's privacy regulator, so they definitely committed a crime, at least there: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jun/15/belgium-facebook-court-privacy-breaches-ads https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jun/15/belgium-f... My analogy was that it shouldn't be up to me to defend myself from someone else's nefarious actions. I should not have to install ad blockers to avoid getting stalked by Facebook.
      - ThomPete 7y ago
        But you havent explained the crime yet.
- username223 7y ago
  > So use an ad blocker. It's about thirty seconds to set up, and very user-friendly. Even with the default lists, they do a great job. Have you ever tried to set up ad/tracker blocking for a non-tech person? If it actually protects their privacy, then it's also a huge pain in the ass that randomly breaks things and requires constant attention. DNS- or IP-level blocking works best, but requires constant maintenance. Then there are the various caches. What breaks when you block "*.googleapis.com"? Then there's the question of which user-hostile JavaScript APIs you try to block. WebGL? WebUSB? And from whom? It's endless war.
ThomPete 7y ago
In what way are you being used by FB in ways that it affect you physically. Sounds like its more in principle you are complaining?
- Nextgrid 7y ago
  The data they are collecting about me & my friends is a growing liability. It's a goldmine of highly personal data that can be used for malicious purposes when it finally leaks. They are putting me at risk in order to grow their cancerous business, but when shit hits the fan I will be the one dealing with the consequences, not them (they will just issue their fake apology as usual and carry on).
  - ThomPete 7y ago
    But you haven't given a concrete example of you being actually affected by this so I will assume it's more an on principle argument rather than you actually pointing to any wrongdoing. Your ISP tracks you, Ycombinator tracks you, every site out there that have cookies track you. Everyone can potentially missuse that data they don't have to be Facebook for that.
    - Nextgrid 7y ago
      Would you feel comfortable with someone following you around 24/7 and taking pictures of you? Technically this would be legal - you have no right to privacy on public property. My ISP should not be tracking me (I’m sure some of them are scummy enough to do so anyway). Ycombinator does not track me outside of their own website. Everyone does not have stupid “like” buttons scattered across the entire web for the sole purpose of tracking people outside of their own website.
      - ThomPete 7y ago
        You dont need a like button to track someone. Of course your isp tracks you to see if you download copyrighted content. Your outrage is pretty selective all based on a non concrete potential threat which exist with everything from google to your phone to ycombinator to google analytics. Give me a concrete missuse, not just specualtions based on selctively who you like or dont.
basch 7y ago
So you blame fb, instead of your friends, for your friends handing over your phone number to an advertising company? It might make sense to stop giving your phone number out to your friends. At some point, lets say you have 100 friends, and ONE gives out your number. That's it, its out there. Your phone number is either de facto public information, or you cant really give it out to anybody, except maybe banks for verification.
- y4mi 7y ago
  Facebook doesn't limit itself to phone numbers. They're just a convenient data point to pin everything else they've gathered to your name. And the thing people take offense in isn't the phone number directory... It's everything else that they not only know about, but also sell to unrelated third parties.
  - basch 7y ago
    Third parties like who?
- Nextgrid 7y ago
  When a crazy sociopath manipulates my friends in order to achieve what he wants I’d blame the sociopath and not my friends. If you’re not tech-savvy and don’t know anything about Facebook it’s reasonable to think they will actually keep those contacts private and only use them for what they said they would (aka recommend you people that are in your contacts but you haven’t yet added on FB). Also I don’t have a problem with one friend accidentally giving away my number to one bad guy. I have a problem with a toxic company using that phone number to build a graph of my relationships and my friends’.
  - basch 7y ago
    So you have a problem with them using the contacts in the literal way they said they would, to build a graph to suggest friends to people. Seems like being mad you got bacon from a bacon salesman, screaming that you were told it would be pork.

coding123 7y ago

Wouldn't it have been more fun to talk to them on the phone about that stuff?

birksherty 7y ago
That's what I do. I find it much better to not knowing everything about my family and friends all the time. So I talk over phone and we talk for hours. After ending the call I feel happy. I never feel like that using social media. When we meet physically, there are so much to talk about and share.

overcast 7y ago

At what cost?

blhack 7y ago
$0.00?