5 ms·

So much of the arguments over housing contain some sort of slippery slope statement of "I don't want my city to become Hong Kong or Dubai." But imagine if SF/SV

So much of the arguments over housing contain some sort of slippery slope statement of "I don't want my city to become Hong Kong or Dubai." But imagine if SF/SV started building housing that looked a lot like Amsterdam https://www.jetsetter.com/uploads/sites/7/2018/04/lVBcs3gf-1380x690.jpeg https://www.jetsetter.com/uploads/sites/7/2018/04/lVBcs3gf-1..., Paris https://c8.alamy.com/comp/RR1A0X/elegant-parisian-apartment-block-along-rue-raumur-paris-france-RR1A0X.jpg https://c8.alamy.com/comp/RR1A0X/elegant-parisian-apartment-..., or even New York https://static01.nyt.com/images/2014/05/11/realestate/20140511-EXCLUSIVE-slide-2S7H/20140511-EXCLUSIVE-slide-2S7H-master1050.jpg https://static01.nyt.com/images/2014/05/11/realestate/201405.... Those 5-10 story town houses are far nicer than anything that exists in SF and would provide a huge boost in density. Sure, it would be hugely expensive to recreate something that nice today, but the point is that you can create a beautiful, dense city without going really tall.

pg_is_a_butt 8y ago
Do you know even the first thing about earthquakes? You're an idiot.
jetrink 8y ago
I completely agree that those areas should allow more 5-10 story buildings, but let's not kid ourselves about what they would look like. They would be One-Plus-Fives [1]. 1. http://archplanbaltimore.blogspot.com/2015/03/how-one-plus-five-is-shaping-american_27.html http://archplanbaltimore.blogspot.com/2015/03/how-one-plus-f...
- ema 8y ago
  This is a question to which I haven't found a satisfying answer yet: why do old houses look better than new ones? There are answers like "only good looking houses got preserved" or "it's just perception, in a hundred years people will love the houses being build now as much as the houses which were build in the nineteenth century". I don't really buy such arguments. I had some musings about people no longer caring about living in a beautiful house because with fast transportation there is less incentive to make a good impression on your neighbors. Or maybe it's something about craftsmen making less design decisions because of more planing and prefabrication. But these too are just speculations.
  - chillacy 8y ago
    Are you just musing to yourself? That is, is your question "Why do old houses look better [to me] than new ones?" or are you polling the public? If you're polling the public, taste is a real thing too, modern architects have a different aesthetic. Same shows up in clothing: a simple waterproof polyester jacket from uniqlo vs a hand-sewn trench coat with a million features like epaulets, grenade rings, gunflaps, etc.
- rb808 8y ago
  Nice, I lived in a 1+5, I didn't know they had a name. TBH the quality was good enough. Sound could be quieter but was fine. The biggest problem was sprinkler system, at least once a year there would be a leak or a trigger that would completely destroy 1-3 apts. I dream of concrete now.
- mixmastamyk 8y ago
  I don't see the problem. Could quibble about styling, but that is an order of magnitude nicer than the surface parking lots or 60s shitbox apartments that currently dominate Los Angeles.
Shivetya 8y ago
try to build in San Francisco, just try. The latest attempt was shot down because it would have shadow encroach eighteen percent of a city park, not even where kids congregate as its a two acre park next to a school [1]. This was after getting past every previous hurdle. As in, when anyone can block a private project nothing gets done. Oh you can try to put one up but you have to buy everyone off or so handicap your project it cannot be affordably built. Another horror story is the ever ongoing saga to build apartments by a laundromat owner [2] America's housing project is simply because of government and the courts. Politicians through special interest groups which funnel money to their campaign and friends; namely highly paid positions with little more than a part time job, to courts which treat every opposing idea as having merit. [1] https://www.sfchronicle.com/politics/article/SF-supervisors-reject-housing-project-that-would-13755026.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/politics/article/SF-supervisors-... [2] https://reason.com/2019/03/19/the-most-contested-apartment-b https://reason.com/2019/03/19/the-most-contested-apartment-b
rb808 8y ago
True but those three cities aren't any cheaper than SF, esp given local salaries.

pg_is_a_butt 8y ago

Do you know even the first thing about earthquakes? You're an idiot.

jetrink 8y ago

I completely agree that those areas should allow more 5-10 story buildings, but let's not kid ourselves about what they would look like. They would be One-Plus-Fives [1]. 1. http://archplanbaltimore.blogspot.com/2015/03/how-one-plus-five-is-shaping-american_27.html http://archplanbaltimore.blogspot.com/2015/03/how-one-plus-f...

ema 8y ago
This is a question to which I haven't found a satisfying answer yet: why do old houses look better than new ones? There are answers like "only good looking houses got preserved" or "it's just perception, in a hundred years people will love the houses being build now as much as the houses which were build in the nineteenth century". I don't really buy such arguments. I had some musings about people no longer caring about living in a beautiful house because with fast transportation there is less incentive to make a good impression on your neighbors. Or maybe it's something about craftsmen making less design decisions because of more planing and prefabrication. But these too are just speculations.
- chillacy 8y ago
  Are you just musing to yourself? That is, is your question "Why do old houses look better [to me] than new ones?" or are you polling the public? If you're polling the public, taste is a real thing too, modern architects have a different aesthetic. Same shows up in clothing: a simple waterproof polyester jacket from uniqlo vs a hand-sewn trench coat with a million features like epaulets, grenade rings, gunflaps, etc.
rb808 8y ago
Nice, I lived in a 1+5, I didn't know they had a name. TBH the quality was good enough. Sound could be quieter but was fine. The biggest problem was sprinkler system, at least once a year there would be a leak or a trigger that would completely destroy 1-3 apts. I dream of concrete now.
mixmastamyk 8y ago
I don't see the problem. Could quibble about styling, but that is an order of magnitude nicer than the surface parking lots or 60s shitbox apartments that currently dominate Los Angeles.

Shivetya 8y ago

try to build in San Francisco, just try. The latest attempt was shot down because it would have shadow encroach eighteen percent of a city park, not even where kids congregate as its a two acre park next to a school [1]. This was after getting past every previous hurdle. As in, when anyone can block a private project nothing gets done. Oh you can try to put one up but you have to buy everyone off or so handicap your project it cannot be affordably built. Another horror story is the ever ongoing saga to build apartments by a laundromat owner [2] America's housing project is simply because of government and the courts. Politicians through special interest groups which funnel money to their campaign and friends; namely highly paid positions with little more than a part time job, to courts which treat every opposing idea as having merit. [1] https://www.sfchronicle.com/politics/article/SF-supervisors-reject-housing-project-that-would-13755026.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/politics/article/SF-supervisors-... [2] https://reason.com/2019/03/19/the-most-contested-apartment-b https://reason.com/2019/03/19/the-most-contested-apartment-b

rb808 8y ago

True but those three cities aren't any cheaper than SF, esp given local salaries.