4 ms·

But the results are very strong. In the treatment group, almost 1 in 5 patients went from severe autistic symptoms to normal (clear). And almost 2 in 5 patients

But the results are very strong. In the treatment group, almost 1 in 5 patients went from severe autistic symptoms to normal (clear). And almost 2 in 5 patients went from severe to mild. This begs the question, is any other treatment known to produce such strong results?

gameswithgo 8y ago
Given the method of measuring the results I'm not sure we can know anything about how strong the results are without a control group. It seems there is a deal of subjectivity in interpreting the results, and when this is the case crazy stuff can and does happen, regularly.
- strainer 8y ago
  Can you clarify what you are saying about the method of measuring results?
  - teraflop 8y ago
    The study evaluated the severity of autism symptoms (using subjective questionnaires) before and after the treatment, but didn't compare those results to a control group of people who weren't treated the same way. It's like finding a couple dozen people with the flu, feeding them chicken soup, and then reporting that a month later they feel healthier, so the soup must have helped. Maybe it did, maybe it didn't, but you didn't measure that so you don't know.
    - strainer 8y ago
      I asked as an aside to the matter of control group - what is considered "given" about "the method of measurement" ? According to this professional medical trial, the recorded ASD scores are "based on the Childhood Autism Rating Scale (CARS) rated by a professional evaluator" You should have specific knowledge of that evaluation in order to criticize it as relying on "subjective questionnaires" and shouldn't introduce doubt by simply stating something as "given".
balabaster 8y ago
It would be interesting to see if this has similar effects on other candidates that have other mental symptoms classified as mental illness. ADHD, ODD, OCD, Bipolar, Depression etc. I have two children with combinations of these symptoms and it's staggering how many of the symptoms could be interpreted either way depending on the classifying doctor's specialty.
admax88q 8y ago
With my new growth serum 90% of children in my study grew 1 foot or more over 2 years. No need for a control group the effect is so strong!
hannob 8y ago
> But the results are very strong. Great, so we have a study showing that either the treatment or the placebo effect is very strong. Wait, that's not very useful, isn't it?
smt88 8y ago
The methodology is so weak that it's impossible to know whether the results were strong or not. Studies of psychological conditions are notoriously hard because much of the quantification is subjective, but this study wasn't even blinded and had no control.
avip 8y ago
Sans control group the results are non existent. There is no spoon. Hence it’s equally strong and week.
- SubiculumCode 8y ago
  Well i could tell uou from data i am working with that improvements in ASD are not that frequent and not of such magnitude. Obviously this could be an issue with their coding, but just for context, those changes are not typical seen in other cohorts. Proper funded study now needed. Longitudinal clinical trials are not cheap.
  - avip 8y ago
    I agree. Improvements in ASD are uncommon. You know what is common? Industry driven undisclosed Gut bacteria related shit science.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

gameswithgo 8y ago

Given the method of measuring the results I'm not sure we can know anything about how strong the results are without a control group. It seems there is a deal of subjectivity in interpreting the results, and when this is the case crazy stuff can and does happen, regularly.

strainer 8y ago
Can you clarify what you are saying about the method of measuring results?
- teraflop 8y ago
  The study evaluated the severity of autism symptoms (using subjective questionnaires) before and after the treatment, but didn't compare those results to a control group of people who weren't treated the same way. It's like finding a couple dozen people with the flu, feeding them chicken soup, and then reporting that a month later they feel healthier, so the soup must have helped. Maybe it did, maybe it didn't, but you didn't measure that so you don't know.
  - strainer 8y ago
    I asked as an aside to the matter of control group - what is considered "given" about "the method of measurement" ? According to this professional medical trial, the recorded ASD scores are "based on the Childhood Autism Rating Scale (CARS) rated by a professional evaluator" You should have specific knowledge of that evaluation in order to criticize it as relying on "subjective questionnaires" and shouldn't introduce doubt by simply stating something as "given".

balabaster 8y ago

It would be interesting to see if this has similar effects on other candidates that have other mental symptoms classified as mental illness. ADHD, ODD, OCD, Bipolar, Depression etc. I have two children with combinations of these symptoms and it's staggering how many of the symptoms could be interpreted either way depending on the classifying doctor's specialty.

admax88q 8y ago

With my new growth serum 90% of children in my study grew 1 foot or more over 2 years. No need for a control group the effect is so strong!

hannob 8y ago

> But the results are very strong. Great, so we have a study showing that either the treatment or the placebo effect is very strong. Wait, that's not very useful, isn't it?

smt88 8y ago

The methodology is so weak that it's impossible to know whether the results were strong or not. Studies of psychological conditions are notoriously hard because much of the quantification is subjective, but this study wasn't even blinded and had no control.

avip 8y ago

Sans control group the results are non existent. There is no spoon. Hence it’s equally strong and week.

SubiculumCode 8y ago
Well i could tell uou from data i am working with that improvements in ASD are not that frequent and not of such magnitude. Obviously this could be an issue with their coding, but just for context, those changes are not typical seen in other cohorts. Proper funded study now needed. Longitudinal clinical trials are not cheap.
- avip 8y ago
  I agree. Improvements in ASD are uncommon. You know what is common? Industry driven undisclosed Gut bacteria related shit science.

deleted 8y ago

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