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He was a fraud that put his parents in legal peril with his scam. He claimed "Tom" synthesized the compounds in America when in reality they were sourced from

He was a fraud that put his parents in legal peril with his scam. He claimed "Tom" synthesized the compounds in America when in reality they were sourced from China. He doesn't have the required skill to test these compounds for purity and heavy metals. He put many people at risk for financial gain.

thwy9103 7y ago
What we can both agree on is that Dat manipulated people from his position in order to benefit himself financially. Is this normal within the Bodybuilding community? I would say yes — you would be hard pressed to find any experienced bodybuilder or powerlifter who hadn't come across deceiving sellers and figures who push their own agenda. They are, after all, participating in an illegal market where substances (such as Peptides) are either outright banned or within a grey area. However, what made Dat and his forum unique was their focus on health and wellness. Bodybuilding was one small area that could benefit (in limited cases) from the use of peptides. >He was a fraud that put his parents in legal peril with his scam. I am not arguing that he was ethical. I am simply stating that the information gathered over time in the forum was invaluable. Many people contributed their knowledge and expertise on a variety of subjects to lengthy discussions. I would argue that readers of HN would find a forum like this very intriguing and worthwhile. Stating that he was a fraud does not invalidate the knowledge he and others shared. >He put many people at risk for financial gain. This is partially correct. Let's look at "...for financial gain": From his arrest and the investigation, in fact, he received immunity (IIRC) and likely gave away his list of buyers which included Olympic athletes and major sports stars (a good reference for the NYT article is actually an Al Jazeera documentary on sports doping: see https://www.aljazeera.com/investigations/the-dark-side.html https://www.aljazeera.com/investigations/the-dark-side.html). In the coming years we may learn more about some of his buyers. Now, for the first part of your statement: >He put many people at risk Dat did not push peptides onto any participants on his forum. Many anecdotes (and from my own experience as well) show that Dat actually recommended members NOT to use peptides for many of their illnesses or other troubles. The application of peptides falls into a small band of uses: muscle rejuvenation and recovery; stimulating GH release in an older age; maximizing IGF-1 and cellular swelling for optimal hypertrophy (and a few other applications). Peptides are not a miracle cure and do not provide the same benefits as other PEDs. Practitioners who used peptides knew fully well what the risk of application was. Nothing was peddled as completely safe and harmless; people were, after all, injecting exotic compounds into their body without proper medical supervision. People who used peptides and other PEDs did so out of their own motivation and will, and knew fully-well what the risks involved were.

thwy9103 7y ago

What we can both agree on is that Dat manipulated people from his position in order to benefit himself financially. Is this normal within the Bodybuilding community? I would say yes — you would be hard pressed to find any experienced bodybuilder or powerlifter who hadn't come across deceiving sellers and figures who push their own agenda. They are, after all, participating in an illegal market where substances (such as Peptides) are either outright banned or within a grey area. However, what made Dat and his forum unique was their focus on health and wellness. Bodybuilding was one small area that could benefit (in limited cases) from the use of peptides. >He was a fraud that put his parents in legal peril with his scam. I am not arguing that he was ethical. I am simply stating that the information gathered over time in the forum was invaluable. Many people contributed their knowledge and expertise on a variety of subjects to lengthy discussions. I would argue that readers of HN would find a forum like this very intriguing and worthwhile. Stating that he was a fraud does not invalidate the knowledge he and others shared. >He put many people at risk for financial gain. This is partially correct. Let's look at "...for financial gain": From his arrest and the investigation, in fact, he received immunity (IIRC) and likely gave away his list of buyers which included Olympic athletes and major sports stars (a good reference for the NYT article is actually an Al Jazeera documentary on sports doping: see https://www.aljazeera.com/investigations/the-dark-side.html https://www.aljazeera.com/investigations/the-dark-side.html). In the coming years we may learn more about some of his buyers. Now, for the first part of your statement: >He put many people at risk Dat did not push peptides onto any participants on his forum. Many anecdotes (and from my own experience as well) show that Dat actually recommended members NOT to use peptides for many of their illnesses or other troubles. The application of peptides falls into a small band of uses: muscle rejuvenation and recovery; stimulating GH release in an older age; maximizing IGF-1 and cellular swelling for optimal hypertrophy (and a few other applications). Peptides are not a miracle cure and do not provide the same benefits as other PEDs. Practitioners who used peptides knew fully well what the risk of application was. Nothing was peddled as completely safe and harmless; people were, after all, injecting exotic compounds into their body without proper medical supervision. People who used peptides and other PEDs did so out of their own motivation and will, and knew fully-well what the risks involved were.