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Agreed - Facebook has a network effect/moat because a new service that's better in every way is useless if your friends aren't on it. Getting the network to mig

Agreed - Facebook has a network effect/moat because a new service that's better in every way is useless if your friends aren't on it. Getting the network to migrate is hard and when this does happen FB is quick to buy the threat (Instagram, WhatsApp) or compete and kill them (Snap). Nobody holds an allegiance to Lyft or Uber - they pick whichever is currently a better deal for both driving and riding. Uber's recent loyalty program is the first thing that slightly moves this in favor of continuing to use Uber, but it's only a little incentive. Large swings in price still favor switching. Their only moat comes from being able to undercut competitors with VC money in any market they appear in until the competitor is dead and Uber can then raise prices to be profitable. It's probably a winner take all market. A SDC competitor would be a threat, but I'd be both impressed and surprised if Google could pull that off.

coryfklein 8y ago
FWIW, I have a loyalty to Lyft and will use its service even if Uber is a bit cheaper, but that's because I'm a techie that is aware of all the shady shit Uber has done.
- brianpgordon 8y ago
  I do this as a rider, but I suspect it's different when you're a driver and your livelihood depends on it.
jfim 8y ago
Uber actually has one moat: their international presence. Other networks don't have it. If you're a business traveler, you can Uber out of most airports without having to install the local application, and business customers are less price sensitive than local customers in general. Definitely agree with your point about nobody having an allegiance for local rides, and it's not clear if Uber can defend against hyper local upstarts at scale.
- munk-a 8y ago
  Except it isn't everywhere, so their moat isn't complete and is eroded by the fact that you need to rely on local transport options in a lot of areas - I don't think this really counts much as a strength of theirs, and I think their current attempts to operate in so many markets and their reliance on a lack of enforcement/laws that can change may make this more of a liability for the company.
karmelapple 8y ago
Quick note that Facebook, unfortunately, has no real competitor for the sheer number of things it does. As soon as one comes out built for non-technical users the way Facebook is - and hopefully is a nonprofit - I’ll go running to it and encourage my friends, too.
- fossuser 8y ago
  I’d want one that’s just an online account with a single picture, name, address, phone number that lets you have friends. No posting - basically just a contact list that’s always up to date because people update themselves. Keybase could be this. The main way to get people in would be a focus on event scheduling relying on twilio and sms for including users that don’t have accounts. Make it cheap but not free ($1/month for people with more than 25 contacts) and advertise no ads or tracking ever.
  - gowld 8y ago
    What would motivate everyone you know to use this service?
    - fossuser 8y ago
      Convenient way to do event scheduling - some friends I know are not on FB so it’s a pain currently. Also having up to date contacts to stay in touch. Phone numbers and addresses change and it’s hard to know when that happens (and currently most people don’t put this on FB).
  - cheerlessbog 8y ago
    Could LinkedIn go this way...bridge from its business network to casual social network also?
    - fossuser 8y ago
      I doubt it - linked in is a mess. They also have too much tied up with recruiters being their real users. I’d want something simple.
CharlesColeman 8y ago
> Nobody holds an allegiance to Lyft or Uber - they pick whichever is currently a better deal for both driving and riding. That's not exactly true: I use Lyft exclusively because have anti-loyalty against Uber because of their greater level of past unscrupulous behavior and scandals.
- fossuser 8y ago
  Yeah - I should strike 'nobody' from my vocabulary in most cases. I meant most people.

coryfklein 8y ago

FWIW, I have a loyalty to Lyft and will use its service even if Uber is a bit cheaper, but that's because I'm a techie that is aware of all the shady shit Uber has done.

brianpgordon 8y ago
I do this as a rider, but I suspect it's different when you're a driver and your livelihood depends on it.

jfim 8y ago

Uber actually has one moat: their international presence. Other networks don't have it. If you're a business traveler, you can Uber out of most airports without having to install the local application, and business customers are less price sensitive than local customers in general. Definitely agree with your point about nobody having an allegiance for local rides, and it's not clear if Uber can defend against hyper local upstarts at scale.

munk-a 8y ago
Except it isn't everywhere, so their moat isn't complete and is eroded by the fact that you need to rely on local transport options in a lot of areas - I don't think this really counts much as a strength of theirs, and I think their current attempts to operate in so many markets and their reliance on a lack of enforcement/laws that can change may make this more of a liability for the company.

karmelapple 8y ago

Quick note that Facebook, unfortunately, has no real competitor for the sheer number of things it does. As soon as one comes out built for non-technical users the way Facebook is - and hopefully is a nonprofit - I’ll go running to it and encourage my friends, too.

fossuser 8y ago
I’d want one that’s just an online account with a single picture, name, address, phone number that lets you have friends. No posting - basically just a contact list that’s always up to date because people update themselves. Keybase could be this. The main way to get people in would be a focus on event scheduling relying on twilio and sms for including users that don’t have accounts. Make it cheap but not free ($1/month for people with more than 25 contacts) and advertise no ads or tracking ever.
- gowld 8y ago
  What would motivate everyone you know to use this service?
  - fossuser 8y ago
    Convenient way to do event scheduling - some friends I know are not on FB so it’s a pain currently. Also having up to date contacts to stay in touch. Phone numbers and addresses change and it’s hard to know when that happens (and currently most people don’t put this on FB).
- cheerlessbog 8y ago
  Could LinkedIn go this way...bridge from its business network to casual social network also?
  - fossuser 8y ago
    I doubt it - linked in is a mess. They also have too much tied up with recruiters being their real users. I’d want something simple.

CharlesColeman 8y ago

> Nobody holds an allegiance to Lyft or Uber - they pick whichever is currently a better deal for both driving and riding. That's not exactly true: I use Lyft exclusively because have anti-loyalty against Uber because of their greater level of past unscrupulous behavior and scandals.

fossuser 8y ago
Yeah - I should strike 'nobody' from my vocabulary in most cases. I meant most people.