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Very sad day. Remember this all started with the leak of the "Collateral murder" video. That's when the Interpol notice went out, and he had to seek asylum at t

Very sad day. Remember this all started with the leak of the "Collateral murder" video. That's when the Interpol notice went out, and he had to seek asylum at the embassy. It was already quite disgusting how powerful entities were able to seemingly fabricate sexual charges as needed. Later on he made very influential enemies by exposing corruption in the democratic political party. Instead of any follow up on that front, the pressure on Assange increased and the whole Russian scaremongering narrative was pushed. Probably to distract from own potential repercussions. For me that looks a lot like government oppression. Something like that wouldn't fly in Germany for example. We had recently had an popular elected political removed from office for something quite insignificant - it was found out, he copy & pasted a few paragraphs in his decade old (and unrelated) doctoral work. It doesn't look much different then the cases where Chinese or Russian governments going after journalists

skilled 7y ago
Video in question: https://collateralmurder.wikileaks.org/ https://collateralmurder.wikileaks.org/
matt4077 7y ago
> Remember this all started with the leak of the "Collateral murder" video. That's when the Interpol notice went out, and he had to seek asylum at the embassy. Collateral Murder was published in April, 2010. The warrant came in November of that year, seven months later. Yes, sure, it possibly takes that long to organise a conspiracy, especially if you have to recruit a Swedish feminist student into the CIA and also get at multiple prosecutors in one of the least corrupt countries in the world. But the connection still seems tenuous.
- throwaway_m73 7y ago
  Don't know what you're talking about with the CIA. More likely they just looked up any previous court cases in every previous place he lived, couldn't find anything open but a juicy closed case that they could ask re-opened as a favor. That's not so strange. Considering that they closed the investigation on the grounds that they couldn't reach him, but refused to question him in london, it seems plausible the whole thing was just a play to get him on their soil.
YeGoblynQueenne 7y ago
>> It was already quite disgusting how powerful entities were able to seemingly fabricate sexual charges as needed. The sexual charges really don't look fabricated or to have had any political motive at all. The wikipedia article on the allegations (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_Assange#Swedish_sexual_assault_allegations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_Assange#Swedish_sexual_...) makes it clear that the charges were dropped after Assange was initially questioned by the police, then a special prosecutor reopened the case. It's not unlikely that the special prosecutor had a political motivation for reopening the case, but it's not at all clear that the women who made the original allegations did. From my reading anyway, Assange crossed a line, perhaps not realising that what he was doing was sexual assault, molestation and "lesser rape" under Swedish law, and he would have gotten away with it if he wasn't Assange, which makes the special prosecutor's reopening the case suspicious. But I can't see any fabrication here. Nobody forced Assange to do what he did (which, as I remember it, was to initiate sex with a sleeping woman who therefore could not give consent). The women who accused him were well within their rights to do so. He just screwed up bad and that made him vulnerable to political persecution.
- thanatropism 7y ago
  Wait, I know about the top-down reopening of the case, but do we know for a fact that the original accusations were kosher, or is this just presumption of innocence for the girls? (I mean, presumption of innocence is important and too often [the word escapes me... only imperfectly/partially given to] would-be sex offenders. On the grounds that we are judging some random girls it should apply; OTOH on the grounds that we are forming an overall character judgment of Assange... this matters if it gets to a jury trial, for example.) [Edit: I plead guilty on the count of using a casual-conversation "girls" in a more serious discussion where it can be legitimately challenged as being implicitly dismissive. Elsewhere I stand my ground, although it's better developed/explained downthread.]
  - YeGoblynQueenne 7y ago
    These were grown women, not girls. Presumption of innocence is granted to the accused, not the accuser, who is not him or herself accused. Is there any reason to assume that the original allegations were somehow "not kosher"?
UweSchmidt 7y ago
Interesting take on cheating on old doctoral work. However, this case had no 'national security' concern, nothing worth covering up. Instead it is a chance to maybe take out a political rival. It's true that the german military is under constant scrutiny, but a lot of bad stuff has been covered up in Germany as well, especially in the world of sexual abuse by churches and institutions that is being uncovered in slow-motion these days.
AsyncAwait 7y ago
As suspected, it was "on behalf of U.S. authorities"[1], exactly as WikiLeaks suspected would be the case. This sets a terrible precedent even for mainstream journalists, so if they have any sense they'd defend him. 1 - https://www.washingtonpost.com/gdpr-consent/?destination=%2fworld%2feurope%2fwikileakss-julian-assange-evicted-from-ecuador-embassy-in-london https://www.washingtonpost.com/gdpr-consent/?destination=%2f...
SmellyGeekBoy 7y ago
> It was already quite disgusting how powerful entities were able to seemingly fabricate sexual charges as needed. Personally I find it disgusting that you'd dismiss these charges so quickly out of hand because they don't fit your existing bias surrounding this guy. But hey, rape isn't a big deal, right?
detaro 7y ago
> Something like that wouldn't fly in Germany for example. I'd not want to rely on that if it touches something "important"/secretive. Minor issues that can be clearly blamed on a single person are easier to admit and follow up on than things that would have widespread impact.
OlleTO 7y ago
This is patently false. The collateral damage video was published on April 5, 2010. Assange entered the Ecuadorian embassy on 19th June 2012. The Interpol warrant for his arrest is dated 30 November, 2010.
Spooky23 7y ago
Give me a break. This guy was a useful idiot who if he didn’t start as a tool of the FSB, became one. The idolization of this guy on web forums is like the college kids of the 90s wearing Che Guevara T-shirt’s.
- pzone 7y ago
  Seriously. Assange doesn't carry a cross on his back, he has histrionic personality disorder.
- Kenji 7y ago
  Che Guevara killed many people. He was a warlord. Assange uncovered a vast amount of actual crimes. Criminals were held accountable through his leaks. Your comparison is complete nonsense.
IgorPartola 7y ago
It’s very interesting how different parts of the web are reacting to this news. HN seems to overwhelmingly be on his side since he leaked some seriously damning stuff about the US government in the past. Reddit’s view overwhelmingly is that WL was a force for transparency and accountability that later devolved into a right wing propaganda machine. I guess a lot of people are pissed as Assange for WikiLeaks’ role in the 2016 election.
Kenji 7y ago
Something like that wouldn't fly in Germany for example. LMAO. Literally laughed out loud. Yeah, no way this could happen in Germany /s.

skilled 7y ago

Video in question: https://collateralmurder.wikileaks.org/ https://collateralmurder.wikileaks.org/

matt4077 7y ago

> Remember this all started with the leak of the "Collateral murder" video. That's when the Interpol notice went out, and he had to seek asylum at the embassy. Collateral Murder was published in April, 2010. The warrant came in November of that year, seven months later. Yes, sure, it possibly takes that long to organise a conspiracy, especially if you have to recruit a Swedish feminist student into the CIA and also get at multiple prosecutors in one of the least corrupt countries in the world. But the connection still seems tenuous.

throwaway_m73 7y ago
Don't know what you're talking about with the CIA. More likely they just looked up any previous court cases in every previous place he lived, couldn't find anything open but a juicy closed case that they could ask re-opened as a favor. That's not so strange. Considering that they closed the investigation on the grounds that they couldn't reach him, but refused to question him in london, it seems plausible the whole thing was just a play to get him on their soil.

YeGoblynQueenne 7y ago

>> It was already quite disgusting how powerful entities were able to seemingly fabricate sexual charges as needed. The sexual charges really don't look fabricated or to have had any political motive at all. The wikipedia article on the allegations (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_Assange#Swedish_sexual_assault_allegations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_Assange#Swedish_sexual_...) makes it clear that the charges were dropped after Assange was initially questioned by the police, then a special prosecutor reopened the case. It's not unlikely that the special prosecutor had a political motivation for reopening the case, but it's not at all clear that the women who made the original allegations did. From my reading anyway, Assange crossed a line, perhaps not realising that what he was doing was sexual assault, molestation and "lesser rape" under Swedish law, and he would have gotten away with it if he wasn't Assange, which makes the special prosecutor's reopening the case suspicious. But I can't see any fabrication here. Nobody forced Assange to do what he did (which, as I remember it, was to initiate sex with a sleeping woman who therefore could not give consent). The women who accused him were well within their rights to do so. He just screwed up bad and that made him vulnerable to political persecution.

thanatropism 7y ago
Wait, I know about the top-down reopening of the case, but do we know for a fact that the original accusations were kosher, or is this just presumption of innocence for the girls? (I mean, presumption of innocence is important and too often [the word escapes me... only imperfectly/partially given to] would-be sex offenders. On the grounds that we are judging some random girls it should apply; OTOH on the grounds that we are forming an overall character judgment of Assange... this matters if it gets to a jury trial, for example.) [Edit: I plead guilty on the count of using a casual-conversation "girls" in a more serious discussion where it can be legitimately challenged as being implicitly dismissive. Elsewhere I stand my ground, although it's better developed/explained downthread.]
- YeGoblynQueenne 7y ago
  These were grown women, not girls. Presumption of innocence is granted to the accused, not the accuser, who is not him or herself accused. Is there any reason to assume that the original allegations were somehow "not kosher"?

UweSchmidt 7y ago

Interesting take on cheating on old doctoral work. However, this case had no 'national security' concern, nothing worth covering up. Instead it is a chance to maybe take out a political rival. It's true that the german military is under constant scrutiny, but a lot of bad stuff has been covered up in Germany as well, especially in the world of sexual abuse by churches and institutions that is being uncovered in slow-motion these days.

AsyncAwait 7y ago

As suspected, it was "on behalf of U.S. authorities"[1], exactly as WikiLeaks suspected would be the case. This sets a terrible precedent even for mainstream journalists, so if they have any sense they'd defend him. 1 - https://www.washingtonpost.com/gdpr-consent/?destination=%2fworld%2feurope%2fwikileakss-julian-assange-evicted-from-ecuador-embassy-in-london https://www.washingtonpost.com/gdpr-consent/?destination=%2f...

SmellyGeekBoy 7y ago

> It was already quite disgusting how powerful entities were able to seemingly fabricate sexual charges as needed. Personally I find it disgusting that you'd dismiss these charges so quickly out of hand because they don't fit your existing bias surrounding this guy. But hey, rape isn't a big deal, right?

detaro 7y ago

> Something like that wouldn't fly in Germany for example. I'd not want to rely on that if it touches something "important"/secretive. Minor issues that can be clearly blamed on a single person are easier to admit and follow up on than things that would have widespread impact.

OlleTO 7y ago

This is patently false. The collateral damage video was published on April 5, 2010. Assange entered the Ecuadorian embassy on 19th June 2012. The Interpol warrant for his arrest is dated 30 November, 2010.

Spooky23 7y ago

Give me a break. This guy was a useful idiot who if he didn’t start as a tool of the FSB, became one. The idolization of this guy on web forums is like the college kids of the 90s wearing Che Guevara T-shirt’s.

pzone 7y ago
Seriously. Assange doesn't carry a cross on his back, he has histrionic personality disorder.
Kenji 7y ago
Che Guevara killed many people. He was a warlord. Assange uncovered a vast amount of actual crimes. Criminals were held accountable through his leaks. Your comparison is complete nonsense.

IgorPartola 7y ago

It’s very interesting how different parts of the web are reacting to this news. HN seems to overwhelmingly be on his side since he leaked some seriously damning stuff about the US government in the past. Reddit’s view overwhelmingly is that WL was a force for transparency and accountability that later devolved into a right wing propaganda machine. I guess a lot of people are pissed as Assange for WikiLeaks’ role in the 2016 election.

Kenji 7y ago

Something like that wouldn't fly in Germany for example. LMAO. Literally laughed out loud. Yeah, no way this could happen in Germany /s.