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Wait, I enjoy my job, want to write code and get lost in my work and you think that’s pissing in the pool? I know some people at work that sort of have your mi

Wait, I enjoy my job, want to write code and get lost in my work and you think that’s pissing in the pool? I know some people at work that sort of have your mindset. I think it’s the worst. Not only do they not want to help someone who’s passionate you now make me suspect they’re incentivized to undermine hard workers as well, since they make you look bad. Fine, take it easy at work, I don’t care. Just don’t make it harder for people who are trying to get work done.

akoumis 8y ago
You are being exploited. Do you get compensated 1.5x your base for all those 12 hour work days?
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- landryraccoon 8y ago
  Making multiples of what the median American household makes, sitting in front of a computer, in an air conditioned office full of free food is being exploited? I'm sure a lot of American workers are being exploited but I'm not.
  - toomuchtodo 8y ago
    So you recognize the abuse disparity. Good! You can then understand why people fight against abuse despite the complaints from the comfortable.
    - landryraccoon 8y ago
      I recognize that a lot of workers in America are exploited and abused. And I support policies to mitigate that. However, trying to associate myself with those or comparing my minor inconveniences to that of blue collar workers seems like it would be extremely spoiled and tone deaf given how exceptionally privileged the average tech worker is compared to blue collar workers.
  - akoumis 8y ago
    At most startups (with illiquid equity), TC adjusted for cost of living (assuming Bay Area) is probably not far from median American household. Employers take advantage of youthful zeal which prevents ICs from understanding their true worth to the business. After startup engineers reach the point where 12 hours days become unacceptable from a logistics standpoint (kids, burnout), what do they have to show other than enriching their founders? If they enjoy programming and would do it in their spare time, why not dedicate 8 hours towards their job and 4 hours towards a personal project with potentially much higher personal reward?
    - landryraccoon 8y ago
      > what do they have to show other than enriching their founders? I don’t get it. Being debt free and having a big pile of money, and a body that still works since I haven’t been doing backbreaking manual labor?
- phamilton 8y ago
  On salary (not hourly) this is a useless question. Say they make 100k/yr. With 40hr weeks that's roughly $50/hr. With 60 hour weeks and 1.5x base pay, you could say it's $20/hr. It's all the same. What you seem to be asking for is for companies to pay you the same, just say your base is lower so they can pay you 1.5x you base for appearances sake. Now, optics aside, if you take an offer with an expectation of 40 hrs / week and they make you work 60, then sure. That's exploitation. But if the expectations are clear upfront, "base pay" is just legalese.
  - akoumis 8y ago
    Maybe I can rephrase. Is OP's base 1.5x that of the average (8 hr/day) worker base at comparable companies?
goobynight 8y ago
I want you to work hard, I just need you to be paid more (hopefully a lot!). I'm saying it's better if I'm paid less than you. What I don't want is for you to put in more effort for the same pay and establish a "new normal". That's all it takes for us both to be happy. I don't want to hold you back, m'dude.

akoumis 8y ago

You are being exploited. Do you get compensated 1.5x your base for all those 12 hour work days?

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
landryraccoon 8y ago
Making multiples of what the median American household makes, sitting in front of a computer, in an air conditioned office full of free food is being exploited? I'm sure a lot of American workers are being exploited but I'm not.
- toomuchtodo 8y ago
  So you recognize the abuse disparity. Good! You can then understand why people fight against abuse despite the complaints from the comfortable.
  - landryraccoon 8y ago
    I recognize that a lot of workers in America are exploited and abused. And I support policies to mitigate that. However, trying to associate myself with those or comparing my minor inconveniences to that of blue collar workers seems like it would be extremely spoiled and tone deaf given how exceptionally privileged the average tech worker is compared to blue collar workers.
- akoumis 8y ago
  At most startups (with illiquid equity), TC adjusted for cost of living (assuming Bay Area) is probably not far from median American household. Employers take advantage of youthful zeal which prevents ICs from understanding their true worth to the business. After startup engineers reach the point where 12 hours days become unacceptable from a logistics standpoint (kids, burnout), what do they have to show other than enriching their founders? If they enjoy programming and would do it in their spare time, why not dedicate 8 hours towards their job and 4 hours towards a personal project with potentially much higher personal reward?
  - landryraccoon 8y ago
    > what do they have to show other than enriching their founders? I don’t get it. Being debt free and having a big pile of money, and a body that still works since I haven’t been doing backbreaking manual labor?
phamilton 8y ago
On salary (not hourly) this is a useless question. Say they make 100k/yr. With 40hr weeks that's roughly $50/hr. With 60 hour weeks and 1.5x base pay, you could say it's $20/hr. It's all the same. What you seem to be asking for is for companies to pay you the same, just say your base is lower so they can pay you 1.5x you base for appearances sake. Now, optics aside, if you take an offer with an expectation of 40 hrs / week and they make you work 60, then sure. That's exploitation. But if the expectations are clear upfront, "base pay" is just legalese.
- akoumis 8y ago
  Maybe I can rephrase. Is OP's base 1.5x that of the average (8 hr/day) worker base at comparable companies?

goobynight 8y ago

I want you to work hard, I just need you to be paid more (hopefully a lot!). I'm saying it's better if I'm paid less than you. What I don't want is for you to put in more effort for the same pay and establish a "new normal". That's all it takes for us both to be happy. I don't want to hold you back, m'dude.