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What's preventing a OSS solution to this? What I can think of off the top of my head: * Lack of e-file permission * Lack of any kind of legal recourse or audi

by 0xfeba 8y ago

What's preventing a OSS solution to this? What I can think of off the top of my head: * Lack of e-file permission * Lack of any kind of legal recourse or audit protection for the user * Constantly changing tax system After a casual search on GitHub I see a few calculator projects but nothing serious. I'd be down to help make a free competitor to Intuit. I see no reason to use a non-static site unless it's to keep previous years data, but that's iffy and sounds like it requires a whole other legal consideration.

castlecrasher2 8y ago
I think the biggest reasons are 1) the vast amount of subject matter expertise required, especially with each state having its own rules, and 2) pretty much any risk at all of having an incorrect return because of buggy prep software is enough to deter most people from using it.
chadash 8y ago
The problem is that the system requires constant maintenance every time some tax law changes in any state, and great maintenance is something that only the most well funded OSS projects get. And you need participation from lawyers and accountants, not just software developers. As the article notes, there are already free solutions for people with basic income situations (W-2, some bank interest, no stock sales) making under $66k. Personally, I don't mind paying $100 to turbotax for the peace of mind of knowing that at the very least, they have a staff of tax experts looking over the details of their filing process. Now, if the IRS came along with an official app that showed me what information they already had and I just needed to make some small adjustments from there (assuming my tax situation isn't complicated), then yeah, I'd use that. And it's a bit crazy that we don't have that. But unlike many countries, we are taxed at both the federal and state levels, which makes the process much more complicated. And to complicate things further, the two interact: I can deduct some of my state taxes from my federal taxes (though less than before). And don't even get me started with the complications of a move from state to state. EDIT: thinking about this a bit more. What really annoys me about the current system isn't necessarily that I pay to file my taxes. It's that it's so easy to miss things. Maybe i have a bank account that earned $12 in interest and I earned $20 from money that I put into lendingclub.com two years ago. It's annoying that the government has this information, but on the other hand, it's very easy for me to not see (or forget about) the email/snail-mail that I got about this income and then forget to declare it on my taxes. Yes, I know that the IRS isn't sending me to jail for forgetting to pay $5 in taxes, but in general, the process would be much less stressful if I had some kind of centralized reminder of all the income I made.
- hobs 8y ago
  I mind, because turbotax actively lobbies to make the tax system more complex, and to put us in this situation. Pretty much all the major tax preparers do this, and they are pretty scummy.
- pnutjam 8y ago
  Let the irs handle federal and let the states worry about their own.
  - chadash 8y ago
    The problem is that these two interact. You get a deduction on your federal return for your state taxes. There are those who want to eliminate this (and the 2018 changes significantly reduced this deduction), but doing so is--IMHO--unfair to those living in high tax states.
gpapilion 8y ago
Those are the first three. If you want to offer state income taxes, that means you’ll need to also implement those rules. There are also a ton of legal restrictions on handling data, that if done wrong send you to jail.
- mikeyouse 8y ago
  Even worse -- Since State and Local income taxes are (partially) deductible on your Federal taxes -- you need to implement those rules no matter if you plan on filing State and Local returns. edit Actually now that I think about it, since the standard deduction is increased, you could catch the majority of simple returns by just assuming the standard deduction and including a few disclaimers about the option to itemize.
  - toast0 8y ago
    The federal deduction for state and local taxes doesn't require knowledge of local rules, just the amounts paid. If you overpay in tax year X and get a refund in tax year Y when filing your local tax return, that's covered in federal tax year Y.
JamesBarney 8y ago
One of the biggest benefit of government provided returns is they already have a bunch of information on you so it can come pre-filled. And for a lot of people all they need to do is sign and send back.
alexkavon 8y ago
Also interested. I see a lot of criticism of the idea, but there's more than one way to skin a cat.

by 0xfeba 8y ago

castlecrasher2 8y ago

I think the biggest reasons are 1) the vast amount of subject matter expertise required, especially with each state having its own rules, and 2) pretty much any risk at all of having an incorrect return because of buggy prep software is enough to deter most people from using it.

chadash 8y ago

The problem is that the system requires constant maintenance every time some tax law changes in any state, and great maintenance is something that only the most well funded OSS projects get. And you need participation from lawyers and accountants, not just software developers. As the article notes, there are already free solutions for people with basic income situations (W-2, some bank interest, no stock sales) making under $66k. Personally, I don't mind paying $100 to turbotax for the peace of mind of knowing that at the very least, they have a staff of tax experts looking over the details of their filing process. Now, if the IRS came along with an official app that showed me what information they already had and I just needed to make some small adjustments from there (assuming my tax situation isn't complicated), then yeah, I'd use that. And it's a bit crazy that we don't have that. But unlike many countries, we are taxed at both the federal and state levels, which makes the process much more complicated. And to complicate things further, the two interact: I can deduct some of my state taxes from my federal taxes (though less than before). And don't even get me started with the complications of a move from state to state. EDIT: thinking about this a bit more. What really annoys me about the current system isn't necessarily that I pay to file my taxes. It's that it's so easy to miss things. Maybe i have a bank account that earned $12 in interest and I earned $20 from money that I put into lendingclub.com two years ago. It's annoying that the government has this information, but on the other hand, it's very easy for me to not see (or forget about) the email/snail-mail that I got about this income and then forget to declare it on my taxes. Yes, I know that the IRS isn't sending me to jail for forgetting to pay $5 in taxes, but in general, the process would be much less stressful if I had some kind of centralized reminder of all the income I made.

hobs 8y ago
I mind, because turbotax actively lobbies to make the tax system more complex, and to put us in this situation. Pretty much all the major tax preparers do this, and they are pretty scummy.
pnutjam 8y ago
Let the irs handle federal and let the states worry about their own.
- chadash 8y ago
  The problem is that these two interact. You get a deduction on your federal return for your state taxes. There are those who want to eliminate this (and the 2018 changes significantly reduced this deduction), but doing so is--IMHO--unfair to those living in high tax states.

gpapilion 8y ago

Those are the first three. If you want to offer state income taxes, that means you’ll need to also implement those rules. There are also a ton of legal restrictions on handling data, that if done wrong send you to jail.

mikeyouse 8y ago
Even worse -- Since State and Local income taxes are (partially) deductible on your Federal taxes -- you need to implement those rules no matter if you plan on filing State and Local returns. edit Actually now that I think about it, since the standard deduction is increased, you could catch the majority of simple returns by just assuming the standard deduction and including a few disclaimers about the option to itemize.
- toast0 8y ago
  The federal deduction for state and local taxes doesn't require knowledge of local rules, just the amounts paid. If you overpay in tax year X and get a refund in tax year Y when filing your local tax return, that's covered in federal tax year Y.

JamesBarney 8y ago

One of the biggest benefit of government provided returns is they already have a bunch of information on you so it can come pre-filled. And for a lot of people all they need to do is sign and send back.

alexkavon 8y ago

Also interested. I see a lot of criticism of the idea, but there's more than one way to skin a cat.