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I was raised evangelical, specifically Southern Baptist. There is a relentless focus on positivity. On prayers being answered. The person, that you're replying

I was raised evangelical, specifically Southern Baptist. There is a relentless focus on positivity. On prayers being answered. The person, that you're replying to, got it largely correct, at least as my childhood faith goes. Sure, even the most deluded Baptists realize death is inevitable. And they're not entirely hostile to DNR. But their approach to the sanctity of life, and the countless stories of last minute miracles, means they will take an aggressive approach. "Pulling the plug" was often considered suicide / murder, and many in my church considered it a start to mass euthanasia of the old and chronically infirm. Perhaps your experience in Christianity is different. But you should educate yourself and realize your experience is far from universal. The brouhaha over Terri Schiavo was not an anomaly in my former faith. The evangelical approach has created much suffering for people in end of life care. I have no qualms about tarring such people for what they perpetuate.

learc83 8y ago
I was also raised Southern Baptist (though I’m a liberal mainline protestant now) and my dad was an assistant pastor/choir director for most of my childhood. I couldn’t disagree with many aspects of Southern Baptist theology and doctrine more, but this was not my experience at all. Sure people prayed for sick family members, but the focus was always more on repenting and being reunited in heaven than it was on staying alive via miracles. If anything, in my experience, devoutly religious Southern Baptists tend to be more accepting of death than less religious people. >"Pulling the plug" was often considered suicide / murder, and many in my church considered it a start to mass euthanasia of the old and chronically infirm. I agree that evangelicals tend to be very strongly against assisted suicide. Part of that is that anti-abortion activists groups are also anti-euthanasia and part of their tactics include scaring old people by convincing them that assisted suicide will eventually lead to forced euthanasia. I don’t however believe that most or even very many evangelicals believe that removing someone from a ventilator is equivalent to suicide/murder.
- dunnevens 8y ago
  We apparently had vastly different experiences within the same denomination. Prayers were almost always for healing. Repentence almost never came into it as the subject of the prayers was usually "saved". Nor were the prayers for being reunited in heaven because that was assumed to be a given. Feeding into all of this were the half-baked stories from the pulpit of healing. Of some miraculous last minute renewal of health. Always the result of praying, fasting, etc. Once the death happened, they were accepting of it. But they fought like hell until that moment. This was my experience. There is (or used to be) some variance between SBC churches, so I don't doubt your experience was different.
  - learc83 8y ago
    >Prayers were almost always for healing. Repentence almost never came into it as the subject of the prayers was usually "saved". Nor were the prayers for being reunited in heaven because that was assumed to be a given. I didn't mean the focus of prayers. I meant the overall focus--sermons, Sunday school etc... >Feeding into all of this were the half-baked stories from the pulpit of healing. Of some miraculous last minute renewal of health. Always the result of praying, fasting, etc. I've heard thousands of hours of sermons in multiple SBC churches from dozens of pastors, and I've been to multiple conventions as a delegate. While I have heard stories about miraculous recoveries from the pulpit, they were fairly rare and not an important focus. The focus on miraculous healing sounds more like a charismatic church than an average SBC church. Now as you said, there is a lot of variation among SBC churches. It sounds like the churches you were involved in had a much more of a charismatic bent than was common.
    - dunnevens 8y ago
      Not charismatic in the slightest. But my church definitely put the "Southern" in Southern Baptist. Very folksy at times. And when I say "healing", it was always healing from God. There was no belief in faith healing. And on top of all that, I sometimes conflate my "church" memories with school. I was sent to a strict Baptist Christian school. A very conservative and horrible place which often made my church look like a bunch of hippies by comparison. Sometimes the terrible theology from one bleeds into the other.

learc83 8y ago

I was also raised Southern Baptist (though I’m a liberal mainline protestant now) and my dad was an assistant pastor/choir director for most of my childhood. I couldn’t disagree with many aspects of Southern Baptist theology and doctrine more, but this was not my experience at all. Sure people prayed for sick family members, but the focus was always more on repenting and being reunited in heaven than it was on staying alive via miracles. If anything, in my experience, devoutly religious Southern Baptists tend to be more accepting of death than less religious people. >"Pulling the plug" was often considered suicide / murder, and many in my church considered it a start to mass euthanasia of the old and chronically infirm. I agree that evangelicals tend to be very strongly against assisted suicide. Part of that is that anti-abortion activists groups are also anti-euthanasia and part of their tactics include scaring old people by convincing them that assisted suicide will eventually lead to forced euthanasia. I don’t however believe that most or even very many evangelicals believe that removing someone from a ventilator is equivalent to suicide/murder.

dunnevens 8y ago
We apparently had vastly different experiences within the same denomination. Prayers were almost always for healing. Repentence almost never came into it as the subject of the prayers was usually "saved". Nor were the prayers for being reunited in heaven because that was assumed to be a given. Feeding into all of this were the half-baked stories from the pulpit of healing. Of some miraculous last minute renewal of health. Always the result of praying, fasting, etc. Once the death happened, they were accepting of it. But they fought like hell until that moment. This was my experience. There is (or used to be) some variance between SBC churches, so I don't doubt your experience was different.
- learc83 8y ago
  >Prayers were almost always for healing. Repentence almost never came into it as the subject of the prayers was usually "saved". Nor were the prayers for being reunited in heaven because that was assumed to be a given. I didn't mean the focus of prayers. I meant the overall focus--sermons, Sunday school etc... >Feeding into all of this were the half-baked stories from the pulpit of healing. Of some miraculous last minute renewal of health. Always the result of praying, fasting, etc. I've heard thousands of hours of sermons in multiple SBC churches from dozens of pastors, and I've been to multiple conventions as a delegate. While I have heard stories about miraculous recoveries from the pulpit, they were fairly rare and not an important focus. The focus on miraculous healing sounds more like a charismatic church than an average SBC church. Now as you said, there is a lot of variation among SBC churches. It sounds like the churches you were involved in had a much more of a charismatic bent than was common.
  - dunnevens 8y ago
    Not charismatic in the slightest. But my church definitely put the "Southern" in Southern Baptist. Very folksy at times. And when I say "healing", it was always healing from God. There was no belief in faith healing. And on top of all that, I sometimes conflate my "church" memories with school. I was sent to a strict Baptist Christian school. A very conservative and horrible place which often made my church look like a bunch of hippies by comparison. Sometimes the terrible theology from one bleeds into the other.