4 ms·

They did transition from selling DRM albums, to unencrypted music, so this does seem possible.

by e1ven 8y ago

shmerl 8y ago
Even major film publishers agree, that selling DRM-free video is fine. But they are too beholden to their backwards ways to do anything about it. See: https://www.gog.com/forum/general/introducing_gogcom_drmfree_movies/post499 https://www.gog.com/forum/general/introducing_gogcom_drmfree...
- gruez 8y ago
  >Even major film publishers agree, that selling DRM-free video is fine. What are those "major film publishers"? All the movies in your link are niche.
  - shmerl 8y ago
    They didn't list them, but they said quite explicitly: IWI and myself spoke to most of the major studios in the U.S. and Europe. We spoke to 8 out of the 10 most famous studios out there. By studios I assume they actually mean publishers, who control the copyright. The huge ones. They admitted, DRM is pointless: We met lots of interesting studio executives, who totally understood our pragmatic arguments. Many of them even admitted that there is no DRM that can prevent a title from being pirated and that some of their movies sometimes even got pirated before release, just like games unfortunately. But failed to do anything about it: We even got one offer approved by the business folks of a major studio, but the deal eventually got cancelled because lawyers were worried that it would give the impression that majors are giving up the fight agains piracy. Also, most of the major studios told us, each with almost the very same words: "we like your ideas, but we neither want to the first studio to say yes, nor the last one. Please let us know when one of the other major studios says yes, we will then probably consider following".
    - gruez 8y ago
      > Many of them > even admitted that there is no DRM that can prevent a > title from being pirated and that some of their movies > sometimes even got pirated before release, just like > games unfortunately. I don't see that as being indicative of anything. They were only pitching to release classics, and even then, only 1 studio was willing to sign up. The most optimistic interpretation of this is that studios are okay with DRM-free releases for their classics, but not for their newly released blockbusters.
      - shmerl 8y ago
        Whether you see that or not, the market is not addressed, whether because of fear of doing something first or simply backward thinking mentality of lawyers and others in that mostly legacy industry. I.e. instead of selling video DRM-free, they are losing sales to piracy which provides these DRM-free options already. Smarter execs would have started competing by providing legal DRM-free buying options. Whether it's recent blockbusters or old classics is irrelevant. The issue applies to both equally. The reason GOG started with classics when addressing these execs, is to have easier time overcoming common stereotypes and fears. Not because DRM-free is only relevant for classics. What they discovered is that even with classics, the backwards thinking is too entrenched there.
cwyers 8y ago
The key here is "selling." You won't get DRM-free rentals or a la carte video; we didn't with audio. Yes, if you buy an album, it's DRM free. Spotify still has DRM in it.
- shmerl 8y ago
  The problem is lack of buying options. Music has many stores to buy it DRM-free. Video used to be sold on optical disks, but with transition to digital (who buys disks today?), there are no options to buy video DRM-free. The lack is naturally filled by piracy, since media execs don't care to address the market.
- lozf 8y ago
  Apart from DRM, if you stream or "buy a download" of an Album, many have watermarks which in some cases are audible and may detract from the listening experience.
  - shmerl 8y ago
    Bandcamp sells good quality FLAC. I've never heard any audible watermarks there.
  - scarface74 8y ago
    Who sells music with audible watermarks?
    - lozf 7y ago
      AFIAA, all/most releases on labels owned by Universal Music Group, and possibly some Sony releases. https://arstechnica.com/uncategorized/2007/08/universal-to-track-drm-free-music-online-via-watermarking/ https://arstechnica.com/uncategorized/2007/08/universal-to-t... https://www.mattmontag.com/music/universals-audible-watermark https://www.mattmontag.com/music/universals-audible-watermar... https://community.spotify.com/t5/Content-Questions/Audible-watermarks-degrading-sound-on-Spotify-premium/td-p/1300815 https://community.spotify.com/t5/Content-Questions/Audible-w... https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/18472-audible-watermarking/ https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/18472-audible-water... https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/is-universal-music-group-using-audible-watermarks-on-digital-files.334991/page-3 https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/is-universal-music-gr... https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5580197 https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5580197 https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,112052.0.html https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,112052.0.html https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,117462.0.html https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,117462.0.html https://rec.music.classical.recordings.narkive.com/Nh7Ya8vd/umg-fraud-audible-watermarking-of-all-online-music https://rec.music.classical.recordings.narkive.com/Nh7Ya8vd/... https://hardforum.com/threads/audible-watermark-umg-digital-distributions.1802366/ https://hardforum.com/threads/audible-watermark-umg-digital-... etc.

They did transition from selling DRM albums, to unencrypted music, so this does seem possible.

by e1ven 8y ago

They did transition from selling DRM albums, to unencrypted music, so this does seem possible.

Even major film publishers agree, that selling DRM-free video is fine. But they are too beholden to their backwards ways to do anything about it. See: https://www.gog.com/forum/general/introducing_gogcom_drmfree_movies/post499 https://www.gog.com/forum/general/introducing_gogcom_drmfree...

gruez 8y ago
>Even major film publishers agree, that selling DRM-free video is fine. What are those "major film publishers"? All the movies in your link are niche.
- shmerl 8y ago
  They didn't list them, but they said quite explicitly: IWI and myself spoke to most of the major studios in the U.S. and Europe. We spoke to 8 out of the 10 most famous studios out there. By studios I assume they actually mean publishers, who control the copyright. The huge ones. They admitted, DRM is pointless: We met lots of interesting studio executives, who totally understood our pragmatic arguments. Many of them even admitted that there is no DRM that can prevent a title from being pirated and that some of their movies sometimes even got pirated before release, just like games unfortunately. But failed to do anything about it: We even got one offer approved by the business folks of a major studio, but the deal eventually got cancelled because lawyers were worried that it would give the impression that majors are giving up the fight agains piracy. Also, most of the major studios told us, each with almost the very same words: "we like your ideas, but we neither want to the first studio to say yes, nor the last one. Please let us know when one of the other major studios says yes, we will then probably consider following".
  - gruez 8y ago
    > Many of them > even admitted that there is no DRM that can prevent a > title from being pirated and that some of their movies > sometimes even got pirated before release, just like > games unfortunately. I don't see that as being indicative of anything. They were only pitching to release classics, and even then, only 1 studio was willing to sign up. The most optimistic interpretation of this is that studios are okay with DRM-free releases for their classics, but not for their newly released blockbusters.
    - shmerl 8y ago
      Whether you see that or not, the market is not addressed, whether because of fear of doing something first or simply backward thinking mentality of lawyers and others in that mostly legacy industry. I.e. instead of selling video DRM-free, they are losing sales to piracy which provides these DRM-free options already. Smarter execs would have started competing by providing legal DRM-free buying options. Whether it's recent blockbusters or old classics is irrelevant. The issue applies to both equally. The reason GOG started with classics when addressing these execs, is to have easier time overcoming common stereotypes and fears. Not because DRM-free is only relevant for classics. What they discovered is that even with classics, the backwards thinking is too entrenched there.

cwyers 8y ago

The key here is "selling." You won't get DRM-free rentals or a la carte video; we didn't with audio. Yes, if you buy an album, it's DRM free. Spotify still has DRM in it.

shmerl 8y ago
The problem is lack of buying options. Music has many stores to buy it DRM-free. Video used to be sold on optical disks, but with transition to digital (who buys disks today?), there are no options to buy video DRM-free. The lack is naturally filled by piracy, since media execs don't care to address the market.
lozf 8y ago
Apart from DRM, if you stream or "buy a download" of an Album, many have watermarks which in some cases are audible and may detract from the listening experience.
- shmerl 8y ago
  Bandcamp sells good quality FLAC. I've never heard any audible watermarks there.
- scarface74 8y ago
  Who sells music with audible watermarks?
  - lozf 7y ago
    AFIAA, all/most releases on labels owned by Universal Music Group, and possibly some Sony releases. https://arstechnica.com/uncategorized/2007/08/universal-to-track-drm-free-music-online-via-watermarking/ https://arstechnica.com/uncategorized/2007/08/universal-to-t... https://www.mattmontag.com/music/universals-audible-watermark https://www.mattmontag.com/music/universals-audible-watermar... https://community.spotify.com/t5/Content-Questions/Audible-watermarks-degrading-sound-on-Spotify-premium/td-p/1300815 https://community.spotify.com/t5/Content-Questions/Audible-w... https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/18472-audible-watermarking/ https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/18472-audible-water... https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/is-universal-music-group-using-audible-watermarks-on-digital-files.334991/page-3 https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/is-universal-music-gr... https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5580197 https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5580197 https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,112052.0.html https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,112052.0.html https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,117462.0.html https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,117462.0.html https://rec.music.classical.recordings.narkive.com/Nh7Ya8vd/umg-fraud-audible-watermarking-of-all-online-music https://rec.music.classical.recordings.narkive.com/Nh7Ya8vd/... https://hardforum.com/threads/audible-watermark-umg-digital-distributions.1802366/ https://hardforum.com/threads/audible-watermark-umg-digital-... etc.