4 ms·

The cheapest 4G modem I can find is still $80. I wonder how they are making the entire phone for just $7

ac29 8y ago
The SoC they are using (Qualcomm 205) seems to be less than $10 in single unit quantities: https://www.kynix.com/Detail/1331087/MSM8905.html https://www.kynix.com/Detail/1331087/MSM8905.html
- TkTech 8y ago
  From that site: 1+: $9.87257 10+: $9.31375 100+: $8.78655 500+: $8.28920 1000+: $7.82000 That is absurdly cheap, and you can be sure with million-unit orders they're probably getting half that price and working direct with the manufacturer. $7.82 per unit @ 1000 for that feature set[1] brings it into the realm of hobbyists to make their own phones. Order the chips, prototype PCB, battery, charger circuit, low-res touchscreen , and mounts for USB+SD+audio from China and get them within a week. 3D print some cases, spend 20 days trying to get video output working on the completely undocumented Chinese display, boom. Made your own functional (but ugly and bad) phone for < $35. [1]: https://www.qualcomm.com/products/qualcomm-205-mobile-platform https://www.qualcomm.com/products/qualcomm-205-mobile-platfo...
  - StudentStuff 8y ago
    Looks like the Qualcomm 205 is a pin compatible replacement for the Snapdragon 210/212, whereby they figured out they could trim out a few hardware chunks (H.265 decoding & 8MP camera support) and save on manufacturing (smaller dies) and licensing costs. Plus, this cheaper chip can be dropped into phone designs from 2014 (Snapdragon 210) and 2015 (Snapdragon 212) with little to no engineering or software work. Seems like a great way to reuse tested cheap phone designs without additional cost or delay in getting products to market.
squarefoot 8y ago
There are however some interesting cheaper cards/adapters/dongles worth of investigating. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/lt4120-Snapdragon-X5-LTE-T77W595-T77W595-796928-00-4G-WWAN-MODULE-150M-Elite-x2-840-850/32810984505.html https://www.aliexpress.com/item/lt4120-Snapdragon-X5-LTE-T77... https://www.amazon.com/powerday-Mini-PCI-Adapter-Module/dp/B01ET7KFSQ https://www.amazon.com/powerday-Mini-PCI-Adapter-Module/dp/B... https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2017-Newest-SIM-Card-4G-LTE-USB-Modem-Network-Adapter-Wireless-Sim-Dongle-With-WiFi/32829191561.html https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2017-Newest-SIM-Card-4G-LTE-... Last one is a complete hotspot and apparently can use the USB port either as a 4G modem (maybe WiFi card also through an internal hub?) or as a power supply port when stuck on a power bank.
- blackflame7000 8y ago
  Thanks for the links! One note about the last one is that it looks like it only supports WCDMA: 2100MHz so Verizon is your only option for 4G coverage but they don't support LTE B1/B3 according to this chart (could be outdated) https://www.droid-life.com/2015/02/05/us-wireless-carrier-bands-gsm-cdma-wcdma-lte-verizon-att-sprint-tmobile/ https://www.droid-life.com/2015/02/05/us-wireless-carrier-ba...
  - StudentStuff 8y ago
    Band 13 is Verizon's 700Mhz LTE band, and is the core of Verizon's coverage. Band 4 (2.1Ghz downlink from tower, 1.7Ghz uplink from phone) would be nice for speed, but isn't strictly necessary to build something that has LTE. The only major sticking point with this is Verizon has a nasty habit of letting non-approved devices (like this) run for a few weeks, then suddenly bricking them without any notice. This module meanwhile will work on all of T-Mobile's bands and all of AT&T's commonly deployed bands: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/EC25-AF-Mini-Pcie-CAT4-Wireless-Module-LTE-Module-4G-Module-EC25-B2-B4-B12-B14/32920349180.html https://www.aliexpress.com/item/EC25-AF-Mini-Pcie-CAT4-Wirel... Neither T-Mobile or AT&T will brick your unapproved device, unlike Verizon.
    - squarefoot 8y ago

ac29 8y ago

The SoC they are using (Qualcomm 205) seems to be less than $10 in single unit quantities: https://www.kynix.com/Detail/1331087/MSM8905.html https://www.kynix.com/Detail/1331087/MSM8905.html

TkTech 8y ago
From that site: 1+: $9.87257 10+: $9.31375 100+: $8.78655 500+: $8.28920 1000+: $7.82000 That is absurdly cheap, and you can be sure with million-unit orders they're probably getting half that price and working direct with the manufacturer. $7.82 per unit @ 1000 for that feature set[1] brings it into the realm of hobbyists to make their own phones. Order the chips, prototype PCB, battery, charger circuit, low-res touchscreen , and mounts for USB+SD+audio from China and get them within a week. 3D print some cases, spend 20 days trying to get video output working on the completely undocumented Chinese display, boom. Made your own functional (but ugly and bad) phone for < $35. [1]: https://www.qualcomm.com/products/qualcomm-205-mobile-platform https://www.qualcomm.com/products/qualcomm-205-mobile-platfo...
- StudentStuff 8y ago
  Looks like the Qualcomm 205 is a pin compatible replacement for the Snapdragon 210/212, whereby they figured out they could trim out a few hardware chunks (H.265 decoding & 8MP camera support) and save on manufacturing (smaller dies) and licensing costs. Plus, this cheaper chip can be dropped into phone designs from 2014 (Snapdragon 210) and 2015 (Snapdragon 212) with little to no engineering or software work. Seems like a great way to reuse tested cheap phone designs without additional cost or delay in getting products to market.

squarefoot 8y ago

There are however some interesting cheaper cards/adapters/dongles worth of investigating. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/lt4120-Snapdragon-X5-LTE-T77W595-T77W595-796928-00-4G-WWAN-MODULE-150M-Elite-x2-840-850/32810984505.html https://www.aliexpress.com/item/lt4120-Snapdragon-X5-LTE-T77... https://www.amazon.com/powerday-Mini-PCI-Adapter-Module/dp/B01ET7KFSQ https://www.amazon.com/powerday-Mini-PCI-Adapter-Module/dp/B... https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2017-Newest-SIM-Card-4G-LTE-USB-Modem-Network-Adapter-Wireless-Sim-Dongle-With-WiFi/32829191561.html https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2017-Newest-SIM-Card-4G-LTE-... Last one is a complete hotspot and apparently can use the USB port either as a 4G modem (maybe WiFi card also through an internal hub?) or as a power supply port when stuck on a power bank.

blackflame7000 8y ago
Thanks for the links! One note about the last one is that it looks like it only supports WCDMA: 2100MHz so Verizon is your only option for 4G coverage but they don't support LTE B1/B3 according to this chart (could be outdated) https://www.droid-life.com/2015/02/05/us-wireless-carrier-bands-gsm-cdma-wcdma-lte-verizon-att-sprint-tmobile/ https://www.droid-life.com/2015/02/05/us-wireless-carrier-ba...
- StudentStuff 8y ago
  Band 13 is Verizon's 700Mhz LTE band, and is the core of Verizon's coverage. Band 4 (2.1Ghz downlink from tower, 1.7Ghz uplink from phone) would be nice for speed, but isn't strictly necessary to build something that has LTE. The only major sticking point with this is Verizon has a nasty habit of letting non-approved devices (like this) run for a few weeks, then suddenly bricking them without any notice. This module meanwhile will work on all of T-Mobile's bands and all of AT&T's commonly deployed bands: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/EC25-AF-Mini-Pcie-CAT4-Wireless-Module-LTE-Module-4G-Module-EC25-B2-B4-B12-B14/32920349180.html https://www.aliexpress.com/item/EC25-AF-Mini-Pcie-CAT4-Wirel... Neither T-Mobile or AT&T will brick your unapproved device, unlike Verizon.
  - squarefoot 8y ago