5 ms·

I don't have much experience with MacBooks, but ThinkPads (at least certain lines) are very much of this nature. I have a 2008 ThinkPad which is still usable an

I don't have much experience with MacBooks, but ThinkPads (at least certain lines) are very much of this nature. I have a 2008 ThinkPad which is still usable and in great condition (I've upgraded various things on it, which the design also makes relatively easy).

dredmorbius 8y ago
Where / how do you upgrade?
- _emacsomancer_ 8y ago
  At home. The ThinkPads come with comprehensive manuals and one can easily (by undoing one screw) change the drive, (by undoing a couple of screws) upgrade memory, (by undoing a few screws) replace the screen, (by undoing a few more screws) replace the keyboard and/or access the motherboard.
  - goldcd 8y ago
    I've not taken a thinkpad apart for a long time - but my memory of upgrading them is a great one. Yes, they have the technical manuals easily available - but they had the information embedded in their molds for the parts. e.g. If you wanted to 'upgrade the memory' you just removed every screw that had a 'memory logo' next to the screw and then wiggled stuff to see what moved. Eventually you'd see a nice empty memory slot.
    - _emacsomancer_ 8y ago
      Yes, that's true. I think the main thing I actually referred to the manual for was the screen (esp. on the X200 where it was a bit trickier; later models are easier). The other bits are more or less intuitive, aided by the icons as you point out.
  - dredmorbius 8y ago
    Thanks. I've done basics (mem, HDD/SSD), not keyboard or display.
msisk6 8y ago
This is so true. I just replaced the screen on my x230; the new screen cost $75 on ebay, the benzel came off with two screws, the screen itself with 4 screws (all normal philips) and one easily undone connector. 5 minutes to do the whole job.
notthemessiah 8y ago
In the relative scheme of things, ThinkPads are easier to repair/upgrade than other computers, but still colossally wasteful compared to desktops and many non-computer devices. There's no way to take an old ThinkPad and add anything to the motherboard without replacing it entirely. Today's devices have even more forced-obsolescence, wtih DRM-locked BIOSes to stop upgrading components, NVidia Tegra processors won't even let you upgrade the OS. With the ubiquity of copyright enforcement, devices are increasingly forced to comply with remote deletion of copyrighted works. OpenWRT may soon become illegal under FCC rules.
- _emacsomancer_ 8y ago
  The T-series can have the CPU upgraded at least. I'm not convinced they're any more wasteful than desktops, which will need upgraded motherboards after some time. Also, compared to non-computer electronic devices, I'd say ThinkPads fare well. Microwaves don't last 10 years anymore, for example.
  - Lukas_Skywalker 8y ago
    I have long been looking for notebooks where the CPU can be upgraded. Do you have any specific model/manufacturing year where this is possible?
    - _emacsomancer_ 8y ago
      T430, W530 at least. See, https://medium.com/@n4ru/the-definitive-t430-modding-guide-3dff3f6a8e2e https://medium.com/@n4ru/the-definitive-t430-modding-guide-3... , for instance.
  - notthemessiah 8y ago
    My point is that if something goes wrong as things often do with laptops, it's very difficult to replace it when it's all on one motherboard. I've got an old Thinkpad which is a beast and mostly works, but it has a problem where the power supply stops occasionally and beeps at me. If it were a desktop I could simply replace the PSU, which is modular and standardized. Such is not the case with laptops, and there's very little interoperability except for some components. Since the golden era of ThinkPads, most machines have gotten more and more disposable and locked-down, with soldered-on memory and other longevity compromises to reach a smaller form factor.

dredmorbius 8y ago

Where / how do you upgrade?

_emacsomancer_ 8y ago
At home. The ThinkPads come with comprehensive manuals and one can easily (by undoing one screw) change the drive, (by undoing a couple of screws) upgrade memory, (by undoing a few screws) replace the screen, (by undoing a few more screws) replace the keyboard and/or access the motherboard.
- goldcd 8y ago
  I've not taken a thinkpad apart for a long time - but my memory of upgrading them is a great one. Yes, they have the technical manuals easily available - but they had the information embedded in their molds for the parts. e.g. If you wanted to 'upgrade the memory' you just removed every screw that had a 'memory logo' next to the screw and then wiggled stuff to see what moved. Eventually you'd see a nice empty memory slot.
  - _emacsomancer_ 8y ago
    Yes, that's true. I think the main thing I actually referred to the manual for was the screen (esp. on the X200 where it was a bit trickier; later models are easier). The other bits are more or less intuitive, aided by the icons as you point out.
- dredmorbius 8y ago
  Thanks. I've done basics (mem, HDD/SSD), not keyboard or display.

msisk6 8y ago

This is so true. I just replaced the screen on my x230; the new screen cost $75 on ebay, the benzel came off with two screws, the screen itself with 4 screws (all normal philips) and one easily undone connector. 5 minutes to do the whole job.

notthemessiah 8y ago

In the relative scheme of things, ThinkPads are easier to repair/upgrade than other computers, but still colossally wasteful compared to desktops and many non-computer devices. There's no way to take an old ThinkPad and add anything to the motherboard without replacing it entirely. Today's devices have even more forced-obsolescence, wtih DRM-locked BIOSes to stop upgrading components, NVidia Tegra processors won't even let you upgrade the OS. With the ubiquity of copyright enforcement, devices are increasingly forced to comply with remote deletion of copyrighted works. OpenWRT may soon become illegal under FCC rules.

_emacsomancer_ 8y ago
The T-series can have the CPU upgraded at least. I'm not convinced they're any more wasteful than desktops, which will need upgraded motherboards after some time. Also, compared to non-computer electronic devices, I'd say ThinkPads fare well. Microwaves don't last 10 years anymore, for example.
- Lukas_Skywalker 8y ago
  I have long been looking for notebooks where the CPU can be upgraded. Do you have any specific model/manufacturing year where this is possible?
  - _emacsomancer_ 8y ago
    T430, W530 at least. See, https://medium.com/@n4ru/the-definitive-t430-modding-guide-3dff3f6a8e2e https://medium.com/@n4ru/the-definitive-t430-modding-guide-3... , for instance.
- notthemessiah 8y ago
  My point is that if something goes wrong as things often do with laptops, it's very difficult to replace it when it's all on one motherboard. I've got an old Thinkpad which is a beast and mostly works, but it has a problem where the power supply stops occasionally and beeps at me. If it were a desktop I could simply replace the PSU, which is modular and standardized. Such is not the case with laptops, and there's very little interoperability except for some components. Since the golden era of ThinkPads, most machines have gotten more and more disposable and locked-down, with soldered-on memory and other longevity compromises to reach a smaller form factor.