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Tesla is already at $100-150/kwh.

ianai 8y ago
Source? That ultimately reflects better on Tesla’s bottom line than current or near term electric car production across the industry. They’re not selling their batteries at cost to other manufacturers. Until the rest of the industry is at their level the full effects of those lower prices won’t be realized in the market.
- systemBuilder 8y ago
  Nissan accidentally leaked their battery cost for the Leaf, $140/kwh. But they don't do cooling so their batteries die twice as fast as they have to ... Panasonic was livid about this ...
  - spenrose 8y ago
    Our 2015 model year Leaf has not had any observable loss of range, FWIW.
    - m463 8y ago
      Apparently they had a reformulated chemistry, that might help. However, I think the climate you live in has a profound effect: http://www.electricvehiclewiki.com/wiki/battery-capacity-loss/ http://www.electricvehiclewiki.com/wiki/battery-capacity-los... scroll down to the battery aging table depending on location. If you live in Juneau, Alaska you're probably good for a while. Maybe taking steps like not charging to 100% and not discharging below 20% will help.
  - iknowstuff 8y ago
    Googling this brought me back to this comment. Do you have a source for this please?
- tim333 8y ago
  Tesla info: https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/09/100-kwh-tesla-battery-cells-this-year-100-kwh-tesla-battery-packs-in-2020/ https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/09/100-kwh-tesla-battery-c...
  - ianai 8y ago
    I’m confused by the differentiation of 100$/kwh at the cell level vs pack level? Does that mean they’ll still have more than that cost due to the non-lithium parts of the battery for the short term but not the long term? Ie their 74kwh battery might someday cost 7400$ but with the cheaper cost per cell its more like 7400k+X where X is the cost future tech may reduce?
    - Latteland 8y ago
      There is nonneglible cost in the pack. Tesla's have heating and cooling and individual battery wiring. Not sure of the cost difference, maybe 10%more wag
    - _Nat_ 8y ago
      From the linked article [1]: > Transforming cells, via modules, into the whole battery pack typically adds 30% cost per kWh on top of the cost of the cells alone. And to get a bit more info on what a module is [2]: > A battery module is more than just a mechanical frame that holds the cells - it also includes bus bars to connect the cells electrically, a cooling interface and a sensing harness, which sends information about the state of each cell to the battery management system. [1]: https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/09/100-kwh-tesla-battery-cells-this-year-100-kwh-tesla-battery-packs-in-2020/ https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/09/100-kwh-tesla-battery-c... [2]: https://evannex.com/blogs/news/learn-more-about-tesla-battery-cells-modules-and-packs https://evannex.com/blogs/news/learn-more-about-tesla-batter...
    - systemBuilder 8y ago
      Packs need a radiator system like any engine. Tesla cooling systems are leading the industry. Nissan and many plugin battery companies use air cooling which doesn't work and which cuts the battery life in half. Many uncooled Nissan leaf packs failed before a hundred thousand miles.

Source? That ultimately reflects better on Tesla’s bottom line than current or near term electric car production across the industry. They’re not selling their batteries at cost to other manufacturers. Until the rest of the industry is at their level the full effects of those lower prices won’t be realized in the market.

systemBuilder 8y ago
Nissan accidentally leaked their battery cost for the Leaf, $140/kwh. But they don't do cooling so their batteries die twice as fast as they have to ... Panasonic was livid about this ...
- spenrose 8y ago
  Our 2015 model year Leaf has not had any observable loss of range, FWIW.
  - m463 8y ago
    Apparently they had a reformulated chemistry, that might help. However, I think the climate you live in has a profound effect: http://www.electricvehiclewiki.com/wiki/battery-capacity-loss/ http://www.electricvehiclewiki.com/wiki/battery-capacity-los... scroll down to the battery aging table depending on location. If you live in Juneau, Alaska you're probably good for a while. Maybe taking steps like not charging to 100% and not discharging below 20% will help.
- iknowstuff 8y ago
  Googling this brought me back to this comment. Do you have a source for this please?
tim333 8y ago
Tesla info: https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/09/100-kwh-tesla-battery-cells-this-year-100-kwh-tesla-battery-packs-in-2020/ https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/09/100-kwh-tesla-battery-c...
- ianai 8y ago
  I’m confused by the differentiation of 100$/kwh at the cell level vs pack level? Does that mean they’ll still have more than that cost due to the non-lithium parts of the battery for the short term but not the long term? Ie their 74kwh battery might someday cost 7400$ but with the cheaper cost per cell its more like 7400k+X where X is the cost future tech may reduce?
  - Latteland 8y ago
    There is nonneglible cost in the pack. Tesla's have heating and cooling and individual battery wiring. Not sure of the cost difference, maybe 10%more wag
  - _Nat_ 8y ago
    From the linked article [1]: > Transforming cells, via modules, into the whole battery pack typically adds 30% cost per kWh on top of the cost of the cells alone. And to get a bit more info on what a module is [2]: > A battery module is more than just a mechanical frame that holds the cells - it also includes bus bars to connect the cells electrically, a cooling interface and a sensing harness, which sends information about the state of each cell to the battery management system. [1]: https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/09/100-kwh-tesla-battery-cells-this-year-100-kwh-tesla-battery-packs-in-2020/ https://cleantechnica.com/2018/06/09/100-kwh-tesla-battery-c... [2]: https://evannex.com/blogs/news/learn-more-about-tesla-battery-cells-modules-and-packs https://evannex.com/blogs/news/learn-more-about-tesla-batter...
  - systemBuilder 8y ago
    Packs need a radiator system like any engine. Tesla cooling systems are leading the industry. Nissan and many plugin battery companies use air cooling which doesn't work and which cuts the battery life in half. Many uncooled Nissan leaf packs failed before a hundred thousand miles.