5 ms·

I don't get why people are so uptight about other peoples sexual preferences. Surely we're past the whole "Aids is a gay disease" stage by now? I know that was

I don't get why people are so uptight about other peoples sexual preferences. Surely we're past the whole "Aids is a gay disease" stage by now? I know that was a big part of the uptight anti queer movement for a long time. Hell even that term is really self defeating. (Queer) Who I am attracted to is about what I personally like. It has nothing to do with what other people think is right or not. that's thought policing and fuck anyone who thinks that shit is OK.

krapp 8y ago
>Surely we're past the whole "Aids is a gay disease" stage by now? Nope. People still believe that. People still believe that God sends hurricanes and terrorist attacks to punish societies that tolerate LGBT people. People still believe that LGBT people are just closet pedophiles, and equate accepting them with accepting bestiality. The LGBT community itself has people (TERFs) in it who believe transgender people are just men pretending to be women for sexual gratification. We haven't really moved past any of that.
- tree_of_item 8y ago
  > The LGBT community itself has people (TERFs) in it who believe transgender people are just men pretending to be women for sexual gratification. Not all transwomen are like this, but autogynephilia is a thing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blanchard%27s_transsexualism_typology https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blanchard%27s_transsexualism_t... "TERF" is also a word used to describe anyone who understands human sexual dimorphism.
  - lenticular 8y ago
    By "not all," you should say "nearly none." I can tell you must not know any transpeople.
- stcredzero 8y ago
  The LGBT community itself has people (TERFs) in it who believe transgender people are just men pretending to be women for sexual gratification. Many TERFs are effectively identitarians. The unfortunate reality, is that every widespread system which can be exploited, will eventually be exploited. So society needs to be designed with this in mind. Otherwise, one is just providing ammunition to people like TERFs. (Ideological slogans like, "Listen and believe," have probably meant with good intentions, but are epistemologically bankrupt. The same goes for all erosions of due process and innocent until proven guilty.)
- philwelch 8y ago
  People still believe that apostasy should be punished by death. People still believe that Stalin did nothing wrong. People still believe that the Bourbon monarchy was a good regime and that France has faced nothing but centuries of decline since they tried to abolish it. "People still believe" isn't a meaningful or impactful argument. You can find at least 100 people who believe virtually anything, because there are over seven billion people and the human mind has much more than a 1 in 70 million chance of believing something dumb.
  - krapp 8y ago
    We're talking about far more than a few kooks on the fringe of society, though. The beliefs I described are mainstream in some places, and anti-gay bigotry is codified into law in some countries.
    - philwelch 8y ago
      So is punishing apostasy with death--usually the same countries.
  - lenticular 8y ago
    I'm gay. You should believe me when I tell you that plenty of people still believe it is wrong and it does impact me in very big ways. Times that by 10 for transpeople. Do not attempt to speak for these groups when you have no idea of what their experiences are.
    - philwelch 8y ago
      You're assuming that I'm straight. Interesting. Also false.
      - lenticular 8y ago
        Sorry, my mistake. However, you are repeating the claims of crypto-homophobes that deny that anti-LGBT discrimination is still a very big problem. It is still a horrible scourge, and minimizing it is morally wrong. You may not experience too many issues due to what I imagine is a higher-middle class tech industry social status, probably in a coastal city, but others aren't so lucky. I stand by my criticism.
aidsGayPlague 8y ago
The whole "Aids is a gay disease" stage only lasted about 10 or 15 years, during the 1980's and 1990's, and there was a lot more discrimination against homosexuality dating back to periods long, long, long before HIV even existed. Also, you miss one key point, that gay males catch a lot more hate than lesbians. Some of that has to do with the nature of the implied sex acts. Semen and feces are both firmly in the zone of fundamental conceptual disgust, and there's nothing operating on the same visceral level with lesbian sex acts. Menstruation and lactation, after all, are part of the package, whether a woman is gay or straight.
throwaway_98554 8y ago
> Surely we're past the whole "Aids is a gay disease" stage by now? Why would you move past CDC statistics? https://www.cdc.gov/hiv/statistics/overview/ataglance.html https://www.cdc.gov/hiv/statistics/overview/ataglance.html Do you have more precise and reliable numbers?
- lenticular 8y ago
  Try tens of millions of people in Africa. This is an extremely bigoted comment. As a gay man, I am disappointed that HN is allowing viewpoints like this to be spread. This sort of thing is why the tech industry has such a bad reputation with these topics.
  - throwaway_98554 8y ago
    I'm open to seeing the HIV stats of heterosexual VS homosexual African data. Can you link it?
    - lenticular 8y ago
      Try google. This information is easily available.
      - throwaway_98554 8y ago
        If it's easy to find surely you can link it here, if only to support your claim of data more precise and reliable than the CDC.
        lenticular 8y ago
        You know, I am fully aware that your arguments here are disingenuous and motivated by homophobia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning
        deleted 8y ago

krapp 8y ago

>Surely we're past the whole "Aids is a gay disease" stage by now? Nope. People still believe that. People still believe that God sends hurricanes and terrorist attacks to punish societies that tolerate LGBT people. People still believe that LGBT people are just closet pedophiles, and equate accepting them with accepting bestiality. The LGBT community itself has people (TERFs) in it who believe transgender people are just men pretending to be women for sexual gratification. We haven't really moved past any of that.

tree_of_item 8y ago
> The LGBT community itself has people (TERFs) in it who believe transgender people are just men pretending to be women for sexual gratification. Not all transwomen are like this, but autogynephilia is a thing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blanchard%27s_transsexualism_typology https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blanchard%27s_transsexualism_t... "TERF" is also a word used to describe anyone who understands human sexual dimorphism.
- lenticular 8y ago
  By "not all," you should say "nearly none." I can tell you must not know any transpeople.
stcredzero 8y ago
The LGBT community itself has people (TERFs) in it who believe transgender people are just men pretending to be women for sexual gratification. Many TERFs are effectively identitarians. The unfortunate reality, is that every widespread system which can be exploited, will eventually be exploited. So society needs to be designed with this in mind. Otherwise, one is just providing ammunition to people like TERFs. (Ideological slogans like, "Listen and believe," have probably meant with good intentions, but are epistemologically bankrupt. The same goes for all erosions of due process and innocent until proven guilty.)
philwelch 8y ago
People still believe that apostasy should be punished by death. People still believe that Stalin did nothing wrong. People still believe that the Bourbon monarchy was a good regime and that France has faced nothing but centuries of decline since they tried to abolish it. "People still believe" isn't a meaningful or impactful argument. You can find at least 100 people who believe virtually anything, because there are over seven billion people and the human mind has much more than a 1 in 70 million chance of believing something dumb.
- krapp 8y ago
  We're talking about far more than a few kooks on the fringe of society, though. The beliefs I described are mainstream in some places, and anti-gay bigotry is codified into law in some countries.
  - philwelch 8y ago
    So is punishing apostasy with death--usually the same countries.
- lenticular 8y ago
  I'm gay. You should believe me when I tell you that plenty of people still believe it is wrong and it does impact me in very big ways. Times that by 10 for transpeople. Do not attempt to speak for these groups when you have no idea of what their experiences are.
  - philwelch 8y ago
    You're assuming that I'm straight. Interesting. Also false.
    - lenticular 8y ago
      Sorry, my mistake. However, you are repeating the claims of crypto-homophobes that deny that anti-LGBT discrimination is still a very big problem. It is still a horrible scourge, and minimizing it is morally wrong. You may not experience too many issues due to what I imagine is a higher-middle class tech industry social status, probably in a coastal city, but others aren't so lucky. I stand by my criticism.

aidsGayPlague 8y ago

The whole "Aids is a gay disease" stage only lasted about 10 or 15 years, during the 1980's and 1990's, and there was a lot more discrimination against homosexuality dating back to periods long, long, long before HIV even existed. Also, you miss one key point, that gay males catch a lot more hate than lesbians. Some of that has to do with the nature of the implied sex acts. Semen and feces are both firmly in the zone of fundamental conceptual disgust, and there's nothing operating on the same visceral level with lesbian sex acts. Menstruation and lactation, after all, are part of the package, whether a woman is gay or straight.

throwaway_98554 8y ago

> Surely we're past the whole "Aids is a gay disease" stage by now? Why would you move past CDC statistics? https://www.cdc.gov/hiv/statistics/overview/ataglance.html https://www.cdc.gov/hiv/statistics/overview/ataglance.html Do you have more precise and reliable numbers?

lenticular 8y ago
Try tens of millions of people in Africa. This is an extremely bigoted comment. As a gay man, I am disappointed that HN is allowing viewpoints like this to be spread. This sort of thing is why the tech industry has such a bad reputation with these topics.
- throwaway_98554 8y ago
  I'm open to seeing the HIV stats of heterosexual VS homosexual African data. Can you link it?
  - lenticular 8y ago
    Try google. This information is easily available.
    - throwaway_98554 8y ago
      If it's easy to find surely you can link it here, if only to support your claim of data more precise and reliable than the CDC.
      - lenticular 8y ago
        You know, I am fully aware that your arguments here are disingenuous and motivated by homophobia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning
        deleted 8y ago