4 ms·

Enlighten us?

Barrin92 8y ago
The US felt extremely threatened by Japanese manufacturing in the 80s and in fact most of the world had this cultural idea of Japan becoming the dominant global technology force. As a consequence the US government imposed a 100% tariff on Japanese electronics, accused the country of "currency manipulation" (sound familiar?). And on the topic of IP Japanese faced the very same copycat accusations that China does now. Let's just take this fortune article from 1987 as an example: http://archive.fortune.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/1987/12/21/69996/index.htm http://archive.fortune.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive... Try and replace every occurence of Japan with China and see how it sounds. It even seeped into fiction. There's a reason neo-tokyo imagery is at the forefront of Gibson-era sci-fi.
- gamblor956 8y ago
  The big difference is that while Japan was frequently accused of IP theft, the actual occurrences were few and far between as the result of individual corporate activity. Chinese IP theft isn't just rampant--it's actively promoted and paid for by the Chinese government, which even goes so far as to identify targets for IP theft and provides governmental assistance in extracting stolen IP from the victim country.
  - coldtea 8y ago
    >The big difference is that while Japan was frequently accused of IP theft, the actual occurrences were few and far between as the result of individual corporate activity. The accusations against Japanese companies at the time were including that the Japanese government were assisting them, and that the IP theft was part of national competitiveness policy. (And of course in Japan - as in S. Korea - corporations and state go hand in hand, though not to the degree of China). Not that the inverse was also not happening (then and now): https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/07/31/national/wikileaks-alleges-widespread-u-s-spying-on-japanese-government-major-companies/#.XKaAi-gzbUI https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/07/31/national/wikile...
- jdsully 8y ago
  Your own article contradicts you with respect to Japanese and IP theft. Its thesis is that they were just playing the game better: ''Are the Japanese picking our brains?'' a congressional staffer asks. ''Yes. They're doing it very well. They're doing it legally. The question is whether we have a two-way street.'' The Chinese accusations are that illegal methods are used. Which is a major difference.
  - Barrin92 8y ago
    >The Chinese accusations are that illegal methods are used. Which is a major difference. It's really not until the accusations are actually proven to be true. Remember that Bloomberg story about Chinese spy chips in every device on the planet ? Whatever happened to that one? In the current dispute with Huawei, how many accusations are substantiated? Do the Japanese simply get the benefit of the doubt because we're just taking it on faith that they never cooperated with their government in a country that is notoriously corporatist, but the Chinese we'll just designate as thieves?
    - jdsully 8y ago
      It is notable that in prior episodes with Japan the accusations were never made.
      - coldtea 8y ago
        The accusations were extremely common, in newspapers, pundits opinion pieces, politicians etc, in the era of Japan's rise (70s to 90s). From accusations of spying and government subsidies helping their corporations, to tarifs, threats, "taking our jobs", being unpatriotic to get Japanese cars, etc, down to diplomatic pressure (that succeeded) to enforce US-led changes to their currency, to make US exports more viable.

Enlighten us?

The US felt extremely threatened by Japanese manufacturing in the 80s and in fact most of the world had this cultural idea of Japan becoming the dominant global technology force. As a consequence the US government imposed a 100% tariff on Japanese electronics, accused the country of "currency manipulation" (sound familiar?). And on the topic of IP Japanese faced the very same copycat accusations that China does now. Let's just take this fortune article from 1987 as an example: http://archive.fortune.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/1987/12/21/69996/index.htm http://archive.fortune.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive... Try and replace every occurence of Japan with China and see how it sounds. It even seeped into fiction. There's a reason neo-tokyo imagery is at the forefront of Gibson-era sci-fi.

gamblor956 8y ago
The big difference is that while Japan was frequently accused of IP theft, the actual occurrences were few and far between as the result of individual corporate activity. Chinese IP theft isn't just rampant--it's actively promoted and paid for by the Chinese government, which even goes so far as to identify targets for IP theft and provides governmental assistance in extracting stolen IP from the victim country.
- coldtea 8y ago
  >The big difference is that while Japan was frequently accused of IP theft, the actual occurrences were few and far between as the result of individual corporate activity. The accusations against Japanese companies at the time were including that the Japanese government were assisting them, and that the IP theft was part of national competitiveness policy. (And of course in Japan - as in S. Korea - corporations and state go hand in hand, though not to the degree of China). Not that the inverse was also not happening (then and now): https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/07/31/national/wikileaks-alleges-widespread-u-s-spying-on-japanese-government-major-companies/#.XKaAi-gzbUI https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/07/31/national/wikile...
jdsully 8y ago
Your own article contradicts you with respect to Japanese and IP theft. Its thesis is that they were just playing the game better: ''Are the Japanese picking our brains?'' a congressional staffer asks. ''Yes. They're doing it very well. They're doing it legally. The question is whether we have a two-way street.'' The Chinese accusations are that illegal methods are used. Which is a major difference.
- Barrin92 8y ago
  >The Chinese accusations are that illegal methods are used. Which is a major difference. It's really not until the accusations are actually proven to be true. Remember that Bloomberg story about Chinese spy chips in every device on the planet ? Whatever happened to that one? In the current dispute with Huawei, how many accusations are substantiated? Do the Japanese simply get the benefit of the doubt because we're just taking it on faith that they never cooperated with their government in a country that is notoriously corporatist, but the Chinese we'll just designate as thieves?
  - jdsully 8y ago
    It is notable that in prior episodes with Japan the accusations were never made.
    - coldtea 8y ago
      The accusations were extremely common, in newspapers, pundits opinion pieces, politicians etc, in the era of Japan's rise (70s to 90s). From accusations of spying and government subsidies helping their corporations, to tarifs, threats, "taking our jobs", being unpatriotic to get Japanese cars, etc, down to diplomatic pressure (that succeeded) to enforce US-led changes to their currency, to make US exports more viable.