5 ms·

> My Model 3 can conveniently do cross-country trips. Not compared to gasoline, though.

by ntsplnkv2 8y ago

alunchbox 8y ago
Right, which we need to stop using? like yesterday.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
azhenley 8y ago
Maybe. It forces me to take 30 minute breaks every 3-3.5 hours, which I have found far more enjoyable than what I did in my gasoline car (drive for 10 hours with only one five minute break). I quite like stopping at Tesla charging stations. They're generally in shopping areas with food and WiFi, and you can talk to other Tesla owners. It is like a new philosophy of traveling for me :)
- ntsplnkv2 8y ago
  You can do that with a gasoline vehicle if you'd like. Or not, if you'd rather spend your time at your actual destination. Hey I'm all for Tesla improving the experience, it needs to be done, because the reality is the infrastructure is as important as the vehicle.
- what_ever 8y ago
  Also, 30 minutes break is not needed if you are not driving alone.
ssewell 8y ago
Would have to mostly agree here, but it's trading time spent at one place for time spent at another. (Disclosure: I'm a Chevy Volt owner, so I have the option of both EV charging and gasoline, on rare occasion). I recently saw someone make a valid point (IMHO) that I hadn't given much thought in the past: The time spent a DC chargers is somewhat offset by lack of stops at a gas station. Assuming you stop for gas once a week, and it takes 5 minutes to fill up and go... that's around 4.3 hours you spend at a gas station every year. On the other hand, you may spend time at a DC charger during long road trips, but you don't have any obligation to stop at a location to recharge during normal commutes, since you simply charge overnight at home. In other words, you have to stop for gas every X miles in an ICE vehicle, but you may have to stop for a recharge in an EV (usually for long road trips).
- toast0 8y ago
  Plug-in hybrid is best of both here, assuming you have a charger either at home or work, you will increase time between fueling, and you can go on a road trip without worrying about range.
- cameldrv 8y ago
  Yeah but that's neglecting the time it takes to plug and unplug your car every night/morning. I'd say it takes about 15-30 sec for each action. If you do this once per day to make sure you're topped off, and you drive 30 miles per day, you get about 50 miles of charge per minute of your time. A typical gas pump fills at 9 gallons per minute, plus 2-3 minutes to pull into the pump, swipe your credit card, etc. If you have a 15 gallon tank and get 30 mpg, that's about 5 minutes for about 450 miles, or about 90 miles per minute of your time. Tesla should start selling their robot charging snake thing to aleviate this.
  - fattire 8y ago
    If your range is 325 miles (Model 3 LR), charged 90% max you don't have to plug in more than once a week, depending on your commute. Also, people calculating road trip "stop time" seem to forget that when you leave on a multi-day roadtrip, there's usually a oh-crap-I-haven't-changed-my-oil-in-forever stop, and a "fill up before I get on the road" stop. Both of which are not needed before you take off with an EV. You'll leave on your with a full "tank" without the "lets gas up for the trip" stop, and when you return, you again have a full tank the next day without the "damn I'm empty and have work tomorrow so better fill up again" stop.
  - natch 8y ago
    More like 3 seconds to plug / unplug.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
J_cst 8y ago
Tangently on that matter recently I posted a question on HN and would love to read your comments. Thank you https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19542613 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19542613
jtaillon 8y ago
Disclosure: I'm a Tesla owner; I don't understand the point of this argument. Yes, in a ICE vehicle you can reach your destination marginally faster (we're talking about an hour on an 11-hour trip up the I-95 corridor, in my experience), but is that actually an important factor? For 99.9% of trips that are within a couple hundred miles of home, travel time is the same. If time is such an important factor on a long road trip, you should probably just be flying instead. I would venture that the number of people that want to drive > 5 hours, and have a requirement to do so "as fast as humanly possible" is pretty small. In that regard, the Model 3 is a BEV that requires practically zero compromises for both day-to-day and long road trip travelling, which is primarily due to the money and effort Tesla has spent on building the SC network. For that reason, I would not consider another EV besides Tesla until other manufacturers (or whoever) puts their money where their mouths are and builds out a fast-charging infrastructure that enables such long-distance travel.
- ntsplnkv2 8y ago
  A Corolla gets double the range on a tank of gas than a Tesla. > If time is such an important factor on a long road trip, you should probably just be flying instead. This is rather tone deaf. Not surprised. A car designed and priced for rich people, attracts rich people. What a luxury it must be for you to afford to fly. Plenty of people make road trips. Growing up all we did was drive, often times 15 hours, for vacation. Can't imagine stopping every 3 hours for a half hour to charge. That's 2 and a half hours lost out of our vacation. Then you have to make sure there is a place to charge at your actual destination... Tesla certainly has the best build out, they're the disruptors - of course they're ahead. But the value isn't there yet, for me to switch from ICE. It's really expensive. Servicing is an absolute nightmare. Charging at home isn't always quick enough. The supercharger network is on interstates mainly - that gets you a lot of places, not all places. You can continually nip at the edges and say "who really drives like that" or "who's really going to those places." That's beside the point - they're excuses. ICE is simply a better product right now. it has none of the downsides, except eco-friendliness. I mean, hell, you can get a solid Corolla for a fourth of the price of a Model 3. It's great on gas, and gas is cheap anyway. If Tesla figures out its scaling issues and the market adds some competition and the product is there, I'll buy in. Just not ready to yet.
natch 8y ago
You might be surprised. Charging is pretty fast if you run down the battery to say 10 - 20% and then charge only what you need at each supercharger along the way. Overall it is a bit slower than an ICE car if the ICE car is not taking any breaks, but the other aspects of the car make this a very small price to pay. Over time as the supercharger network gets faster and with free software updates the gap will narrow as well.
- dondawest 8y ago
  It is dramatically slower than ICE cars dude. Over time ... it will still be dramatically slower. Teslas are an expensive fragile toy for rich people that can afford to stop for an hour every few hundred miles. But literally who wants to do that ?!?!? Not me
  - steelframe 8y ago
    > Over time ... with free software updates the gap will narrow as well. Yeah, this guy's drinking the Koolaid. I've tried a road trip in a Tesla exactly once. I drive gas on road trips now.
    - natch 8y ago
      There are right and wrong ways to do charging on a road trip. If you’re such a noob that you’ve only done it once, you very likely may have been doing it wrong. So I wouldn’t give your anecdata much weight.
      - dondawest 8y ago
        I would give your anecdata precisely zero weight because it directly contradicts with the hundreds and hundreds of Tesla owners I’ve met and chatted with. Musk is a false prophet dude, leave his religion, your faith in him will not benefit you but it MIGHT make you die in a car crash.
        8y ago

> My Model 3 can conveniently do cross-country trips. Not compared to gasoline, though.

alunchbox 8y ago

Right, which we need to stop using? like yesterday.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

azhenley 8y ago

Maybe. It forces me to take 30 minute breaks every 3-3.5 hours, which I have found far more enjoyable than what I did in my gasoline car (drive for 10 hours with only one five minute break). I quite like stopping at Tesla charging stations. They're generally in shopping areas with food and WiFi, and you can talk to other Tesla owners. It is like a new philosophy of traveling for me :)

ntsplnkv2 8y ago
You can do that with a gasoline vehicle if you'd like. Or not, if you'd rather spend your time at your actual destination. Hey I'm all for Tesla improving the experience, it needs to be done, because the reality is the infrastructure is as important as the vehicle.
what_ever 8y ago
Also, 30 minutes break is not needed if you are not driving alone.

ssewell 8y ago

Would have to mostly agree here, but it's trading time spent at one place for time spent at another. (Disclosure: I'm a Chevy Volt owner, so I have the option of both EV charging and gasoline, on rare occasion). I recently saw someone make a valid point (IMHO) that I hadn't given much thought in the past: The time spent a DC chargers is somewhat offset by lack of stops at a gas station. Assuming you stop for gas once a week, and it takes 5 minutes to fill up and go... that's around 4.3 hours you spend at a gas station every year. On the other hand, you may spend time at a DC charger during long road trips, but you don't have any obligation to stop at a location to recharge during normal commutes, since you simply charge overnight at home. In other words, you have to stop for gas every X miles in an ICE vehicle, but you may have to stop for a recharge in an EV (usually for long road trips).

toast0 8y ago
Plug-in hybrid is best of both here, assuming you have a charger either at home or work, you will increase time between fueling, and you can go on a road trip without worrying about range.
cameldrv 8y ago
Yeah but that's neglecting the time it takes to plug and unplug your car every night/morning. I'd say it takes about 15-30 sec for each action. If you do this once per day to make sure you're topped off, and you drive 30 miles per day, you get about 50 miles of charge per minute of your time. A typical gas pump fills at 9 gallons per minute, plus 2-3 minutes to pull into the pump, swipe your credit card, etc. If you have a 15 gallon tank and get 30 mpg, that's about 5 minutes for about 450 miles, or about 90 miles per minute of your time. Tesla should start selling their robot charging snake thing to aleviate this.
- fattire 8y ago
  If your range is 325 miles (Model 3 LR), charged 90% max you don't have to plug in more than once a week, depending on your commute. Also, people calculating road trip "stop time" seem to forget that when you leave on a multi-day roadtrip, there's usually a oh-crap-I-haven't-changed-my-oil-in-forever stop, and a "fill up before I get on the road" stop. Both of which are not needed before you take off with an EV. You'll leave on your with a full "tank" without the "lets gas up for the trip" stop, and when you return, you again have a full tank the next day without the "damn I'm empty and have work tomorrow so better fill up again" stop.
- natch 8y ago
  More like 3 seconds to plug / unplug.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

J_cst 8y ago

Tangently on that matter recently I posted a question on HN and would love to read your comments. Thank you https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19542613 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19542613

jtaillon 8y ago

Disclosure: I'm a Tesla owner; I don't understand the point of this argument. Yes, in a ICE vehicle you can reach your destination marginally faster (we're talking about an hour on an 11-hour trip up the I-95 corridor, in my experience), but is that actually an important factor? For 99.9% of trips that are within a couple hundred miles of home, travel time is the same. If time is such an important factor on a long road trip, you should probably just be flying instead. I would venture that the number of people that want to drive > 5 hours, and have a requirement to do so "as fast as humanly possible" is pretty small. In that regard, the Model 3 is a BEV that requires practically zero compromises for both day-to-day and long road trip travelling, which is primarily due to the money and effort Tesla has spent on building the SC network. For that reason, I would not consider another EV besides Tesla until other manufacturers (or whoever) puts their money where their mouths are and builds out a fast-charging infrastructure that enables such long-distance travel.

ntsplnkv2 8y ago
A Corolla gets double the range on a tank of gas than a Tesla. > If time is such an important factor on a long road trip, you should probably just be flying instead. This is rather tone deaf. Not surprised. A car designed and priced for rich people, attracts rich people. What a luxury it must be for you to afford to fly. Plenty of people make road trips. Growing up all we did was drive, often times 15 hours, for vacation. Can't imagine stopping every 3 hours for a half hour to charge. That's 2 and a half hours lost out of our vacation. Then you have to make sure there is a place to charge at your actual destination... Tesla certainly has the best build out, they're the disruptors - of course they're ahead. But the value isn't there yet, for me to switch from ICE. It's really expensive. Servicing is an absolute nightmare. Charging at home isn't always quick enough. The supercharger network is on interstates mainly - that gets you a lot of places, not all places. You can continually nip at the edges and say "who really drives like that" or "who's really going to those places." That's beside the point - they're excuses. ICE is simply a better product right now. it has none of the downsides, except eco-friendliness. I mean, hell, you can get a solid Corolla for a fourth of the price of a Model 3. It's great on gas, and gas is cheap anyway. If Tesla figures out its scaling issues and the market adds some competition and the product is there, I'll buy in. Just not ready to yet.

natch 8y ago

You might be surprised. Charging is pretty fast if you run down the battery to say 10 - 20% and then charge only what you need at each supercharger along the way. Overall it is a bit slower than an ICE car if the ICE car is not taking any breaks, but the other aspects of the car make this a very small price to pay. Over time as the supercharger network gets faster and with free software updates the gap will narrow as well.

dondawest 8y ago
It is dramatically slower than ICE cars dude. Over time ... it will still be dramatically slower. Teslas are an expensive fragile toy for rich people that can afford to stop for an hour every few hundred miles. But literally who wants to do that ?!?!? Not me
- steelframe 8y ago
  > Over time ... with free software updates the gap will narrow as well. Yeah, this guy's drinking the Koolaid. I've tried a road trip in a Tesla exactly once. I drive gas on road trips now.
  - natch 8y ago
    There are right and wrong ways to do charging on a road trip. If you’re such a noob that you’ve only done it once, you very likely may have been doing it wrong. So I wouldn’t give your anecdata much weight.
    - dondawest 8y ago
      I would give your anecdata precisely zero weight because it directly contradicts with the hundreds and hundreds of Tesla owners I’ve met and chatted with. Musk is a false prophet dude, leave his religion, your faith in him will not benefit you but it MIGHT make you die in a car crash.
      - 8y ago