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I would love a Tesla if they were 50% cheaper. I used to think that the big car companies weren't able to bring a competitive EV to market because they were bi

I would love a Tesla if they were 50% cheaper. I used to think that the big car companies weren't able to bring a competitive EV to market because they were bigger than Tesla and bogged down in layers of management. Now I'm wondering if Tesla was just over marketed and overly ambitious entering the market and if these later entry EVs from main stream car companies in the next few years will be just as good at a fraction of the price. EDIT: to clarify, I'm not comparing the price of EVs, but the price of a Tesla vs the price of a traditional gas-powered car. If I was only willing to buy an EV, then yes Tesla looks like a great deal.

Klathmon 8y ago
I'm not sure why i'm jumping into this thread, but 50% cheaper!? You want a brand new electric car for $17.5k USD? Even the cheapest ICE cars sold in the US have trouble hitting that number... That just seems like a completely unreasonably high bar to hold EVs to at this point since things like batteries are so much more expensive than an ICE engine.
- mikeash 8y ago
  A quick search on cars.com reveals 1,700 new cars within 50 miles of my zip code for under $15,000. I agree that a decent EV for that price is just not practical yet, but cheap ICE cars have no trouble hitting it.
  - Klathmon 8y ago
    That's fair I guess, I did a cursory search and saw things from Toyota and Nissan in the $16-18k range, and I didn't really search more. But I was also expecting to compare MSRP, but I now realize that it's not really a good comparison since Teslas are bought less like cars (with haggling and discounts) and more like a new phone (you pay the price they set). Still, I'm floored that ICE cars are that cheap!
    - mikeash 8y ago
      Yeah, you can believe the MSRP for Tesla but for other cars you need to see what the local dealers are offering. (And even then, it’s approximate.) The low end gets very basic, but some people just want cheap transportation and don’t care about features.
    - stcredzero 8y ago
      Still, I'm floored that ICE cars are that cheap! If you wait, you'll probably see a special for Nissan Versas just over 10k.
- akhilcacharya 8y ago
  My parents' 2016 Leaf (last gen) was about that price or less after utility price cut ($10k off) and tax credit.
- r_smart 8y ago
  I bought my Honda Fit for $16.5k. It's one of the more expensive cars in it's class, but me, I was willing to pay a little more for the luxury :)
codeulike 8y ago
Kia and Hyundai have some decent EV offerings now that would compete with the Model 3, but they can't get the batteries made due to supply issues so they're only selling small amounts of them. e.g. Kia e-Niro got 'car of the year' in What Car magazine but they've only got 900 for the whole of the UK this year. So one thing Tesla has done right is build a huge battery factory.
mjamesaustin 8y ago
I mean no luxury brand sells a car for $17.5k. I'm sure the entire world would go bananas if the Model 3 were priced at that... Chevy has the Bolt out now at the same price as the SR+ Model 3, and it's absurd how bad the Bolt looks in comparison. The range is the same, but the exterior, performance, and charging capabilities are dramatically inferior to Model 3. The only other competition debuting in the near future is the Nissan Leaf Plus, which costs more than the Model 3 SR, and has all the issues of the Bolt on top of the fact that its battery isn't even actively cooled, which is terrifying for battery longevity.
- neogodless 8y ago
  I think the correct comparison would be Average Selling Price (ASP), which for a Model 3 is nearly $60k USD. So I think when someone suggests a 50% price reduction, they are saying they'd love to buy a Tesla that is real-world, no tax credits necessary, breaking the $30k barrier. The most expensive Toyota Camry barely tops $30k[0], and the vast majority sells for less. So ultimately, mainstream electric cars will have to compete in this space (and probably without tax credits, unfortunately.) I only have one anecdote - my co-worker bought a Model 3, and it was over $60k. That's a luxury! I'm a reasonably well-paid software guy, but I've never spent more than $29k on a car. Currently I drive a hatchback that I bought nearly new for under $20k. So I'm stuck looking at the Nissan Leaf as my option for an electric car, and it would probably work if I kicked my wife out of the garage and installed a charger there. But I'm hesitant to go from a Mazda 3 to a Leaf. [0] https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/2019-Toyota-Camry-Price-c27940 https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/2019-Toyota-Camry-Price-c27940
  - Domenic_S 8y ago
    The $35k price for the base Model 3 is before tax incentives. After tax incentives in CA it's something like $28k + sales tax.
    - FireBeyond 8y ago
      The incentive in CA for the M3 is $2,500, and Tesla's Federal incentive is about to drop to $1,750.

Klathmon 8y ago

I'm not sure why i'm jumping into this thread, but 50% cheaper!? You want a brand new electric car for $17.5k USD? Even the cheapest ICE cars sold in the US have trouble hitting that number... That just seems like a completely unreasonably high bar to hold EVs to at this point since things like batteries are so much more expensive than an ICE engine.

mikeash 8y ago
A quick search on cars.com reveals 1,700 new cars within 50 miles of my zip code for under $15,000. I agree that a decent EV for that price is just not practical yet, but cheap ICE cars have no trouble hitting it.
- Klathmon 8y ago
  That's fair I guess, I did a cursory search and saw things from Toyota and Nissan in the $16-18k range, and I didn't really search more. But I was also expecting to compare MSRP, but I now realize that it's not really a good comparison since Teslas are bought less like cars (with haggling and discounts) and more like a new phone (you pay the price they set). Still, I'm floored that ICE cars are that cheap!
  - mikeash 8y ago
    Yeah, you can believe the MSRP for Tesla but for other cars you need to see what the local dealers are offering. (And even then, it’s approximate.) The low end gets very basic, but some people just want cheap transportation and don’t care about features.
  - stcredzero 8y ago
    Still, I'm floored that ICE cars are that cheap! If you wait, you'll probably see a special for Nissan Versas just over 10k.
akhilcacharya 8y ago
My parents' 2016 Leaf (last gen) was about that price or less after utility price cut ($10k off) and tax credit.
r_smart 8y ago
I bought my Honda Fit for $16.5k. It's one of the more expensive cars in it's class, but me, I was willing to pay a little more for the luxury :)

codeulike 8y ago

Kia and Hyundai have some decent EV offerings now that would compete with the Model 3, but they can't get the batteries made due to supply issues so they're only selling small amounts of them. e.g. Kia e-Niro got 'car of the year' in What Car magazine but they've only got 900 for the whole of the UK this year. So one thing Tesla has done right is build a huge battery factory.

mjamesaustin 8y ago

I mean no luxury brand sells a car for $17.5k. I'm sure the entire world would go bananas if the Model 3 were priced at that... Chevy has the Bolt out now at the same price as the SR+ Model 3, and it's absurd how bad the Bolt looks in comparison. The range is the same, but the exterior, performance, and charging capabilities are dramatically inferior to Model 3. The only other competition debuting in the near future is the Nissan Leaf Plus, which costs more than the Model 3 SR, and has all the issues of the Bolt on top of the fact that its battery isn't even actively cooled, which is terrifying for battery longevity.

neogodless 8y ago
I think the correct comparison would be Average Selling Price (ASP), which for a Model 3 is nearly $60k USD. So I think when someone suggests a 50% price reduction, they are saying they'd love to buy a Tesla that is real-world, no tax credits necessary, breaking the $30k barrier. The most expensive Toyota Camry barely tops $30k[0], and the vast majority sells for less. So ultimately, mainstream electric cars will have to compete in this space (and probably without tax credits, unfortunately.) I only have one anecdote - my co-worker bought a Model 3, and it was over $60k. That's a luxury! I'm a reasonably well-paid software guy, but I've never spent more than $29k on a car. Currently I drive a hatchback that I bought nearly new for under $20k. So I'm stuck looking at the Nissan Leaf as my option for an electric car, and it would probably work if I kicked my wife out of the garage and installed a charger there. But I'm hesitant to go from a Mazda 3 to a Leaf. [0] https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/2019-Toyota-Camry-Price-c27940 https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/2019-Toyota-Camry-Price-c27940
- Domenic_S 8y ago
  The $35k price for the base Model 3 is before tax incentives. After tax incentives in CA it's something like $28k + sales tax.
  - FireBeyond 8y ago
    The incentive in CA for the M3 is $2,500, and Tesla's Federal incentive is about to drop to $1,750.