3 ms·

Where is the idea that software engineers are anti-union coming from? I'd like to know. I like the idea of a software union and would love to flesh that out. I

Where is the idea that software engineers are anti-union coming from? I'd like to know. I like the idea of a software union and would love to flesh that out. Its been well documented that the FANNG corps have been suppressing wages for several years. Software is eating the world and if we have a role in that creation we should have a larger portion of the benefits.

intelliderp 8y ago
Any union-related post on HN fills with anti-union comments pretty fast. It may only be artificial. I suppose HN is as susceptible to astroturfing as any online platform. If that's the case, we would just need an expressly pro-union discussion forum or a subreddit to become popular for the idea to take off. Edit: Huh. Incidentally, I just stumbled upon /r/devunion which appears to be exactly that, although it's shut down.
morenoh149 8y ago
@intelliderp you got buried. I'd love to see links to such anti-union hn discussions. I kinda get that HN is very capitalistic and unions check reckless capitalism. But at the same time HN is very dev focused and unions promise larger benefits/money to devs. I'll go on the record saying I'm pro dev union. Even if its just a glorified professional organization. I'd love to hear the holes in the argument. The corporations are financially motivated to prevent unionization. If you want a piece of the future you have to be just as savvy. One tricky bit is if unionizing just causes a massive exodus of development to offshore. Thoughts on that?
- steveklabnik 8y ago
  Here's a recent HN discussion about unions: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19433610 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19433610 You can read the thread and draw your own conclusions. My impression is taken from reading a number of these threads over years; I could be wrong!
  - morenoh149 8y ago
    My guess is that that sentiment arises from the meritocratic attitude that if you are disproportionately talented you should be compensated much much more. And I get that. To a point. I don't like when corporations collude to artificially suppress wages either. Or when information asymmetry is used to keep an engineer's salary low or prevent negotiating higher salaries. I'll read that discussion.
- intelliderp 8y ago
  Yeah, I'm apparently shadow-banned on HN for some users. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13564440 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13564440 Arguments often encountered: * Compensation/mobility is good enough not to need unions. * Workers don't have enough leverage to do anything anyway. * Unions restrict you in undesirable ways. * Unions are shady and corrupt.

intelliderp 8y ago

Any union-related post on HN fills with anti-union comments pretty fast. It may only be artificial. I suppose HN is as susceptible to astroturfing as any online platform. If that's the case, we would just need an expressly pro-union discussion forum or a subreddit to become popular for the idea to take off. Edit: Huh. Incidentally, I just stumbled upon /r/devunion which appears to be exactly that, although it's shut down.

morenoh149 8y ago

@intelliderp you got buried. I'd love to see links to such anti-union hn discussions. I kinda get that HN is very capitalistic and unions check reckless capitalism. But at the same time HN is very dev focused and unions promise larger benefits/money to devs. I'll go on the record saying I'm pro dev union. Even if its just a glorified professional organization. I'd love to hear the holes in the argument. The corporations are financially motivated to prevent unionization. If you want a piece of the future you have to be just as savvy. One tricky bit is if unionizing just causes a massive exodus of development to offshore. Thoughts on that?

steveklabnik 8y ago
Here's a recent HN discussion about unions: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19433610 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19433610 You can read the thread and draw your own conclusions. My impression is taken from reading a number of these threads over years; I could be wrong!
- morenoh149 8y ago
  My guess is that that sentiment arises from the meritocratic attitude that if you are disproportionately talented you should be compensated much much more. And I get that. To a point. I don't like when corporations collude to artificially suppress wages either. Or when information asymmetry is used to keep an engineer's salary low or prevent negotiating higher salaries. I'll read that discussion.
intelliderp 8y ago
Yeah, I'm apparently shadow-banned on HN for some users. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13564440 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13564440 Arguments often encountered: * Compensation/mobility is good enough not to need unions. * Workers don't have enough leverage to do anything anyway. * Unions restrict you in undesirable ways. * Unions are shady and corrupt.