5 ms·

>Knowing that I have medications available to me that can help me get to sleep is enough that I think I don't actually need the medications any more. Honest qu

by mmjaa 8y ago

>Knowing that I have medications available to me that can help me get to sleep is enough that I think I don't actually need the medications any more. Honest question: Have you ever considered that your insomnia was psychosomatic and, through your doctors involvement in for-profit sales of pharmaceuticals, socially re-inforced?

GlenTheMachine 8y ago
Most chronic insomnia is psychosomatic. The problem with calling it "psychosomatic" is that people who haven't experienced it think that means it isn't real. But it is. You can't just talk yourself out of psychosomatic illnesses. They're as real as any other kind. You need some sort of medical care to manage or overcome them, just as much as if you had a broken leg. In my case, I see my psychiatrist once a quarter for fifteen minutes. Klonopin and Remeron are two of the cheapest drugs there are. My meds cost me less than $40 a year. I don't think anyone is making a lot of money off of me. Cognitive Behavioral Therapy or biofeedback, which are two alternatives that were presented to me, would have been far more expensive.
- martinald 8y ago
  I dont mean to be alarmist but taking benzodiazepines for an extended time (anything more than 2 weeks is probably a bad idea, especially with strong ones such as clonazepam), is definitely not a great idea. There is a very prolonged withdrawal syndrome, with many not reporting feeling completely better after many years in cases of high dose long term usage. You may take the view that you can always take them, but circumstances change (your doctor may no longer be allowed/feel comfortable prescribing for a long time - this happened with opiods) or you may not be able to get access with them for other reasons. The drugs will most likely stop working or rapidly increase in side effects after very long term use, it's generally just a matter of time. I would strongly recommend you get a plan to taper if possible and look into alternatives. Many think the benzodiazepine withdrawal is as bad if not worse than opioid (plus it can be lethal).
  - mastox 8y ago
    I had no idea the impact of benzo's but my first thought after reading the OP and experiencing Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) myself, "Isn't that just a band-aid, not really treating the 'wound'". I guess I'm just agreeing with you from a philosophical point of view. For what's its worth for anyone (including OP) reading this, I found success in studying philosophy as a poor man's CBT especially Existentialism. I think an argument could be made that these two things are the same thing but represented slightly different language and with slightly different goals.
    - flycaliguy 8y ago
      Stoic philosophy has a lot of overlap with CBT. It basically re-opened those cbt books for me and kept me at it.
      - mastox 8y ago
        Also true. And I've probably been heavily influenced by Stoicism as well, its hard to keep track where the lines are when there's so much overlap between the three.
    - GlenTheMachine 8y ago
      As I said in the parent post, I agree, and I am in fact tapering. I'm down to half my original dose. I'm taking it slow. This is something where you really need to listen to your body; it isn't helpful to have a set plan. You need a goal, but you also need to be flexible about it. I tried CBT, and it didn't work. Admittedly I only tried it once. There are lots of different flavors of CBT for insomnia, and maybe if I had tried harder I could have found one that did work. The problem is finding a doctor who knows about it and will work with you, especially if you don't live in a big city. Benzodiazepines are worrisome drugs, but I have to admit that for my insomnia, they were almost magic. Once we got the dose right it went away almost literally overnight. But then, as the OP illustrates, doctors aren't necessarily helpful in getting back off them.
      - 8y ago

by mmjaa 8y ago

GlenTheMachine 8y ago

Most chronic insomnia is psychosomatic. The problem with calling it "psychosomatic" is that people who haven't experienced it think that means it isn't real. But it is. You can't just talk yourself out of psychosomatic illnesses. They're as real as any other kind. You need some sort of medical care to manage or overcome them, just as much as if you had a broken leg. In my case, I see my psychiatrist once a quarter for fifteen minutes. Klonopin and Remeron are two of the cheapest drugs there are. My meds cost me less than $40 a year. I don't think anyone is making a lot of money off of me. Cognitive Behavioral Therapy or biofeedback, which are two alternatives that were presented to me, would have been far more expensive.

martinald 8y ago
I dont mean to be alarmist but taking benzodiazepines for an extended time (anything more than 2 weeks is probably a bad idea, especially with strong ones such as clonazepam), is definitely not a great idea. There is a very prolonged withdrawal syndrome, with many not reporting feeling completely better after many years in cases of high dose long term usage. You may take the view that you can always take them, but circumstances change (your doctor may no longer be allowed/feel comfortable prescribing for a long time - this happened with opiods) or you may not be able to get access with them for other reasons. The drugs will most likely stop working or rapidly increase in side effects after very long term use, it's generally just a matter of time. I would strongly recommend you get a plan to taper if possible and look into alternatives. Many think the benzodiazepine withdrawal is as bad if not worse than opioid (plus it can be lethal).
- mastox 8y ago
  I had no idea the impact of benzo's but my first thought after reading the OP and experiencing Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) myself, "Isn't that just a band-aid, not really treating the 'wound'". I guess I'm just agreeing with you from a philosophical point of view. For what's its worth for anyone (including OP) reading this, I found success in studying philosophy as a poor man's CBT especially Existentialism. I think an argument could be made that these two things are the same thing but represented slightly different language and with slightly different goals.
  - flycaliguy 8y ago
    Stoic philosophy has a lot of overlap with CBT. It basically re-opened those cbt books for me and kept me at it.
    - mastox 8y ago
      Also true. And I've probably been heavily influenced by Stoicism as well, its hard to keep track where the lines are when there's so much overlap between the three.
  - GlenTheMachine 8y ago
    As I said in the parent post, I agree, and I am in fact tapering. I'm down to half my original dose. I'm taking it slow. This is something where you really need to listen to your body; it isn't helpful to have a set plan. You need a goal, but you also need to be flexible about it. I tried CBT, and it didn't work. Admittedly I only tried it once. There are lots of different flavors of CBT for insomnia, and maybe if I had tried harder I could have found one that did work. The problem is finding a doctor who knows about it and will work with you, especially if you don't live in a big city. Benzodiazepines are worrisome drugs, but I have to admit that for my insomnia, they were almost magic. Once we got the dose right it went away almost literally overnight. But then, as the OP illustrates, doctors aren't necessarily helpful in getting back off them.
    - 8y ago