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> Do you see what's not there? Programming language competency. Database knowledge. Things like that. I hear this a lot, but I'm not sure I agree 100%. I want

by meijer 8y ago

> Do you see what's not there? Programming language competency. Database knowledge. Things like that. I hear this a lot, but I'm not sure I agree 100%. I want to work with people who can write idiomatic code and are able to use a database efficiently (or who are at least willing to learn these things).

indigochill 8y ago
I prefer working with idiomatic code. On the other hand, we hired a guy who didn't write idiomatic code but who was a brilliant engineer in general and he was overall a great hire even if I had to bring him up to speed on a couple style points. Overall, I found his general engineering chops dramatically outweighed the minor annoyance of tidying up style foibles.
lucideer 8y ago
Some small counterpoints on idiomatic code: 1. I've worked with people with years of experience in a language who can't (well, really, "won't") write idiomatic code in that language. This has—in my experience—typically come down to overconfidence/arrogance built on top of their experience whereby they've spent enough time with the language to develop their own "better" style. 2. Learning quickly on-the-job typically involved picking up idiomatic style first, before you really gain a deep understanding of the underlying workings. Ideally a good engineer should gain both, but at least initially, I haven't found the former to be a problem for "good" engineers starting out on something new. 3. For some language ecosystems, what's idiomatic changes over time. Flexibility and adaptibility is key to being a good engineer, but if someone has a lot of experience but isn't so adaptible (and/or hasn't brushed up on modern techniques in their ecosystem), this can also lead to non-idiomatic style. I get that some of the things above should be red flags "in an of themselves" when hiring, but I'm just pointing out that a focus on past familiarity with tech can cloud things somewhat, and shouldn't be implicitly prioritised.
augustk 8y ago
Sometimes idiomatic code results in code which is hard to understand, as exemplified by the C idiom `while (s++ = t++);' for copying a string from t to s. It's always good to be able to read idiomatic code, however.

by meijer 8y ago

indigochill 8y ago

I prefer working with idiomatic code. On the other hand, we hired a guy who didn't write idiomatic code but who was a brilliant engineer in general and he was overall a great hire even if I had to bring him up to speed on a couple style points. Overall, I found his general engineering chops dramatically outweighed the minor annoyance of tidying up style foibles.

lucideer 8y ago

Some small counterpoints on idiomatic code: 1. I've worked with people with years of experience in a language who can't (well, really, "won't") write idiomatic code in that language. This has—in my experience—typically come down to overconfidence/arrogance built on top of their experience whereby they've spent enough time with the language to develop their own "better" style. 2. Learning quickly on-the-job typically involved picking up idiomatic style first, before you really gain a deep understanding of the underlying workings. Ideally a good engineer should gain both, but at least initially, I haven't found the former to be a problem for "good" engineers starting out on something new. 3. For some language ecosystems, what's idiomatic changes over time. Flexibility and adaptibility is key to being a good engineer, but if someone has a lot of experience but isn't so adaptible (and/or hasn't brushed up on modern techniques in their ecosystem), this can also lead to non-idiomatic style. I get that some of the things above should be red flags "in an of themselves" when hiring, but I'm just pointing out that a focus on past familiarity with tech can cloud things somewhat, and shouldn't be implicitly prioritised.

augustk 8y ago

Sometimes idiomatic code results in code which is hard to understand, as exemplified by the C idiom `while (s++ = t++);' for copying a string from t to s. It's always good to be able to read idiomatic code, however.