4 ms·

Companies give raises. Have you or anyone you know never gotten a raise?

onion2k 8y ago
It's very common for companies to give a cost of living raise in line with inflation, which is effectively just maintaining your salary at the current "purchasing power". Actual real terms raises that mean you can buy more are quite rare, especially outside of tech. Usually the only way to get a real raise is by changing job, either through promotion or by moving to a different company.
- kzisme 8y ago
  This has been my experience as well - if you want to progress salary wise you are almost required to change jobs every ~3 years to get a meaningful bump in pay.
- statictype 8y ago
  You may need to find a better company or try to do a better job of negotiating? While it's certainly true that jumping around between companies is an easy way to increase your pay, companies routinely do give significant raises to employees. (It may not happen often but even 100% increments do occur)
kzisme 8y ago
2-5% raises are all I've seen pretty much (which is just cost of living).
- Cd00d 8y ago
  I see this sentiment often, but I don't quite understand. Inflation has been at <2% for a while, so how is a 5% raise cost of living? It's actually big. I'm in NYC and our trouble with the subway have highlighted that MTA workers get a standard 6% raise each year as cost of living. But, it's way more than that, and it's actually a salary doubling every 11 years or so, which is not at all in line with overall wage growth - it's huge. Sure, in tech you can jump jobs every 3 years for 20% jumps (until you're 40), but that also isn't reflective of normality and definitely front-loads early career experiences.
  - PeterisP 8y ago
    The big idea is that it's unlike e.g. MTA workers because in tech, after 3 or 5 years, you're not really doing the same job. If you've been hired as a junior dev, then the work that you're doing in year 5 is (or should be) worth much, much more that what you were doing in year 1. What people are expecting isn't a "I'm a bit more effective at my position and have some institutional knowledge, so I'd deserve a bit of a raise", but rather "I was hired at position X. Now I'm de facto doing position Y, so I deserve a salary appropriate to that position", and the appropriate salary to that new position may be 30%, 50% or 100% larger than the initial one. If your company doesn't provide these internal promotions (and the salary jumps appropriate for each tier), then your best people will take "lateral promotions" to other companies whenever they're ready to promote. You won't hire a senior dev by offering 20% more than a junior dev; so as a junior dev in your company becomes (over the years, and of course not all of them do) a senior developer, if their real (inflation adjusted) salary increased only by 20% over these years, that's not reasonable. I mean, it should be reasonable for a young person coming to your company at an entry level job to ask about the career path available. In tech (unlike, for example, fast food) they can start with an assertion that as they gain experience, in ten years they would like to earn double of what they'll be earning now as an entry level developer. It's not a given that they'll succeed, but it's likely, and a realistic plan to achieve if they put in the work. And your company (assuming it's large enough) should have an answer about what's the career path and criteria for them to double their (inflation-adjusted) salary in that time, and raises that are 2-5% (so, a bit above inflation) don't provide such an answer.
  - snovv_crash 8y ago
    Housing is going up way above the 2% mark.
    - rayvd 8y ago
      CPI includes housing already.
      - C1sc0cat 8y ago
        Not In the UK
- cs02rm0 8y ago
  I never had a raise as an employee more than 5%. I only once moved jobs as an employee for less than 50% and I tended to stay for 18 months to 3 years. I've been contacting for 8 years now, have nearly doubled my rate over that time mostly with the same client and never been told they won't pay the rate rise (number of employee devs who been there longer is zero - they haven't had pay rises). I've probably nearly found the limit without calling myself something other than a developer, or giving up being remote. Someone told me at the start of my career that dev jobs don't tend to give pay rises and to just suck it up and move every couple of years if you want the rewards. I think they were about right, short of contracting which changes that relationship. It sucks but companies are wired to take advantage.
auiya 8y ago
Not in the same job role they don't. Not a meaningful amount at least, most times it's barely enough to cover inflation. If you want a meaningful raise you have two choices, play the company's ridiculous Game of Thrones every quarter come promotion time, or go elsewhere. Most of the time it's easier to just go elsewhere.

It's very common for companies to give a cost of living raise in line with inflation, which is effectively just maintaining your salary at the current "purchasing power". Actual real terms raises that mean you can buy more are quite rare, especially outside of tech. Usually the only way to get a real raise is by changing job, either through promotion or by moving to a different company.

kzisme 8y ago
This has been my experience as well - if you want to progress salary wise you are almost required to change jobs every ~3 years to get a meaningful bump in pay.
statictype 8y ago
You may need to find a better company or try to do a better job of negotiating? While it's certainly true that jumping around between companies is an easy way to increase your pay, companies routinely do give significant raises to employees. (It may not happen often but even 100% increments do occur)

kzisme 8y ago

2-5% raises are all I've seen pretty much (which is just cost of living).

Cd00d 8y ago
I see this sentiment often, but I don't quite understand. Inflation has been at <2% for a while, so how is a 5% raise cost of living? It's actually big. I'm in NYC and our trouble with the subway have highlighted that MTA workers get a standard 6% raise each year as cost of living. But, it's way more than that, and it's actually a salary doubling every 11 years or so, which is not at all in line with overall wage growth - it's huge. Sure, in tech you can jump jobs every 3 years for 20% jumps (until you're 40), but that also isn't reflective of normality and definitely front-loads early career experiences.
- PeterisP 8y ago
  The big idea is that it's unlike e.g. MTA workers because in tech, after 3 or 5 years, you're not really doing the same job. If you've been hired as a junior dev, then the work that you're doing in year 5 is (or should be) worth much, much more that what you were doing in year 1. What people are expecting isn't a "I'm a bit more effective at my position and have some institutional knowledge, so I'd deserve a bit of a raise", but rather "I was hired at position X. Now I'm de facto doing position Y, so I deserve a salary appropriate to that position", and the appropriate salary to that new position may be 30%, 50% or 100% larger than the initial one. If your company doesn't provide these internal promotions (and the salary jumps appropriate for each tier), then your best people will take "lateral promotions" to other companies whenever they're ready to promote. You won't hire a senior dev by offering 20% more than a junior dev; so as a junior dev in your company becomes (over the years, and of course not all of them do) a senior developer, if their real (inflation adjusted) salary increased only by 20% over these years, that's not reasonable. I mean, it should be reasonable for a young person coming to your company at an entry level job to ask about the career path available. In tech (unlike, for example, fast food) they can start with an assertion that as they gain experience, in ten years they would like to earn double of what they'll be earning now as an entry level developer. It's not a given that they'll succeed, but it's likely, and a realistic plan to achieve if they put in the work. And your company (assuming it's large enough) should have an answer about what's the career path and criteria for them to double their (inflation-adjusted) salary in that time, and raises that are 2-5% (so, a bit above inflation) don't provide such an answer.
- snovv_crash 8y ago
  Housing is going up way above the 2% mark.
  - rayvd 8y ago
    CPI includes housing already.
    - C1sc0cat 8y ago
      Not In the UK
cs02rm0 8y ago
I never had a raise as an employee more than 5%. I only once moved jobs as an employee for less than 50% and I tended to stay for 18 months to 3 years. I've been contacting for 8 years now, have nearly doubled my rate over that time mostly with the same client and never been told they won't pay the rate rise (number of employee devs who been there longer is zero - they haven't had pay rises). I've probably nearly found the limit without calling myself something other than a developer, or giving up being remote. Someone told me at the start of my career that dev jobs don't tend to give pay rises and to just suck it up and move every couple of years if you want the rewards. I think they were about right, short of contracting which changes that relationship. It sucks but companies are wired to take advantage.

auiya 8y ago

Not in the same job role they don't. Not a meaningful amount at least, most times it's barely enough to cover inflation. If you want a meaningful raise you have two choices, play the company's ridiculous Game of Thrones every quarter come promotion time, or go elsewhere. Most of the time it's easier to just go elsewhere.