5 ms·
Prepare for a hepatitis outbreak... "Some health officials speculate that one trigger of the outbreak might have been the state’s plastic bag ban, which went i
by elchief 8y ago
Prepare for a hepatitis outbreak...
"Some health officials speculate that one trigger of the outbreak might have been the state’s plastic bag ban, which went into effect in November. What had once been a practice of last resort — defecating in a plastic bag and tossing it in the trash — is no longer an option"
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/outbreak-waiting-happen-hepatitis-marches-san-diegos-homeless-community https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/outbreak-waiting-happen-...
- boudin 8y agoA good amount of countries have already banned plastic bags without such issue. If this outbreak was really rrlated to plastic bag ban, there must be another factor that must be much more relevant than the plastic bags themselves. Just look at the list of countries that already banned those: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phase-out_of_lightweight_plastic_bags https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phase-out_of_lightweight_pla...
- ricardobeat 8y agoI wonder what that other factor could be? Maybe people living in abject conditions in the street and defecating in the open? Just a hunch.
- boudin 8y agoObviously homelessness is the core issue, but unfortunately most countries let people live in those conditions. Nonetheless, there was no outbreaks like the one mentioned in the article in other places banning plastic bags. So assuming that there will be the same sad consequences in New York is just wrong. It would be great that nobody had to leave in street, but in the current situation there must be something specific in San Diego that caused the outbreak, and it's obviously not just banning plastic bags.
- village-idiot 8y agoUS cities in my experience have very few public toilets. The only exceptions I can think of are the ones in parks & beaches.
- bobthepanda 8y agoThis is anecdotal, but having lived on both coasts, public defecation is not nearly as prevalent on the East Coast. New York doesn't have a public bathroom system per se, but government offices like libraries are extremely prevalent, and those will have public bathrooms. Some stores also have bathrooms that are more or less open to the public.
- perfunctory 8y agoIf society has to rely on "defecating in a plastic bag and tossing it in the trash" for its health safety - it has much bigger problems than banning plastic bags imho.
- johnchristopher 8y agoSure. But playing the devil's advocate. If that's the case then society had a working solution with plastic bags.
- shakna 8y agoA solution to a symptom, certainly... But not the disease. If removing plastic causes this sort of thing, then something critical has been ignored. It's probably best if the society faces that problem and deals with it.
- closeparen 8y agoIf locks are needed to protect property and safety, something critical has been ignored. It's probably best if society faces that problem and deals with it. If formal schooling is needed to educate children, something critical has been ignored. It's probably best if society faces that problem and deals with it. If medication is needed to keep people healthy, something critical has been ignored. It's probably best if society faces that problem and deals with it. There are no silver bullets, only bullets. Ignore them at your peril.
- shakna 8y agoHaving worse sanitation than the Roman Empire is not comparable to the inevitable breakdown of human form that comes with age. Platitudes are cheap. Examine a statement to see if it's logic bears out before saying that it's impossible to approach safely. Formal education is helpful in treating the root cause of the problem it's addressing, that of knowledge and skill. Complaining disposable plastic bags are necessary for sanitation because of a large homeless society doesn't treat the root: Why are so many people homeless? (And yes, that problem is difficult and requires a multi-faceted approach... But plastic bags to pick up human shit isn't the solution.)
- frereubu 8y ago"Some ... speculate ... might have been..." I'd need a lot more convincing to say something as bold as "prepare for a hepatitis outbreak."
- ForHackernews 8y agoIs America even a first-world nation? "Sorry, we can't get rid of plastic problem because that's actually how we address our public sanitation and homelessness problems."
- aqme28 8y agoThis seems like a problem to be solved by increasing access to public restrooms.
- JadeNB 8y agoCounterpoint: increasing access to public restrooms results in unuseable public restrooms. As someone who (a) likes to 'hike' in-city but (b) has a small bladder, I rely on public restrooms on city trails, and in my admittedly small experience (Fort Worth and San José) they don't just become disgusting, but actively get vandalised within a very short time, after which repairs understandably take a very long time. Somehow the ones in Ann Arbor and Chicago don't seem to get such harsh treatment. I'm not sure why; maybe those cities just budget a lot more for maintenance.
- cdolan 8y agoThis is a great example of intended consequences of making laws. Thanks for sharing never would have thought of that
- dao- 8y agoYou mean unintended?
- tmp192489 8y agoNew York has much stricter laws around getting homeless into shelters than California does.
- dehrmann 8y agoThe climate will do that.
- synaesthesisx 8y agoCalifornia could clearly benefit from this. Housing here is treated as a luxury rather than a right. There are plenty on the streets that should arguably be in institutional care.
- rb808 8y agoNY is the same, just you'll get moved on if you try to set up camp on the street.
- Quinner 8y agoNo, New York mandates that everyone who wants a bed in a shelter gets one. The City does a lot to try to get people into shelters, unfortunately, some people would rather be on the street than in a shelter (some due to mental health issues, some due to concerns about safety in shelters).
- rb808 8y agoAny tent or cardboard makeshift sleeping spot will get destroyed if reported. This isn't SF.
- JasonFruit 8y agoIt's regrettable that there are people living on the streets, but whose housing in particular do they have a right to? Or to whose labor to provide them with housing? Is it more just to provide them with housing by coercion, or to make laws and regulations in such a way as to encourage and reward charitable activity? Or is there another way that doesn't require an implicit gun at the givers' heads?
- Alex3917 8y agoNYC at least has tons of public bathrooms that are currently closed but could easily be reopened again.
- booleandilemma 8y agoWow, I didn’t realize that was an option. Are people really asking themselves “what am I supposed to shit in now?”