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Reading these comments makes me sad, but I am also beginning to understand the opposition to limiting carbon emissions. Introduce an initiative that is "obviou
by jwr 8y ago
Reading these comments makes me sad, but I am also beginning to understand the opposition to limiting carbon emissions.
Introduce an initiative that is "obviously good". I mean, none of the commenters here will be disadvantaged by single-use plastic being banned. It is obviously better for the environment. Whichever way you look at it, it is an improvement on the current state of affairs. And yet, people will moan and complain, criticize, pull out "statistics" out of thin air, say that this "does not solve the real problem", that it isn't important. And this is the enlightened HN community, the epitome of progressiveness.
This is similar to the climate change discussions. Moving away from fossil fuels is obviously better for the environment and for us. And yet, people will moan and complain, criticize, point fingers, say that it's the other guys who pollute, or say that this particular change "doesn't matter", because there are bigger polluters out there.
I am very glad the EU is making this move and I'm happy there are still some places in the world who can effect change. I wish the EU was similarly radical with respect to its beloved car industry, or with moving towards nuclear power (not away from it), but one can hope.
- vimy 8y ago>It is obviously better for the environment. Except it isn't and plastic is for many uses the best material. Take glass for example. Cons of Glass: It breaks It costs more to ship It is more expensive to recycle Glass takes twice as much energy to produce More pollution is created in the manufacturing, shipping and recycling of glass Glass creates more than 6 times the global warming gases than plastic ------------------- Cons of plastic: Litter (but people throw glass away too) Some plastics can leach chemicals Some plastics contain PVCs
- Brakenshire 8y agoUnless I'm missing something, this seems spurious, what makes you think a ban on single use plastic plates, cups, straws, coffee stirrers and cutlery means people will use glass equivalents? Or rather, to make the comparison valid, single use glass equivalents.
- Mirioron 8y agoThey won't. By and large, people will simply do without these products because the equivalents will be too expensive for most people. But he's just trying to explain that if people tried to stay at the same level of quality of life then they'd have to switch to technology that isn't advantageous to the environment.
- kazinator 8y agoGlass is a mineral; the earth's crust is full of practically the same thing. Glass can be reused; sterilizing and re-filling milk bottles is a thing, for instance. Plastic doesn't really recycle; it downcycles. Plastic from higher grade products usually can't be used for the same grade, only for lower-grade stuff. Downcycling is less of a problem for glass.
- apacheCamel 8y agoI can't agree with this more. Seems like so many people would rather bicker and moan about the "real issue" behind climate change than actually get out there and try something new. I am glad Europe is trying to fight this battle. They are trying to fix it, it may not be the end all solution but it is a step towards one.
- thatoneuser 8y agoOK here's the elephant in the room - China produces about a third of all pollution. I wanna say over half of ocean pollution comes from 10 rivers in China. In other words - China affects this whole thing more than anyone else in the world. And they're not far away from being more than the rest combined. So now look at a family who uses some product like straws or plastic forks. Is it a huge inconvenience for them to stop? Probably not. A little obnoxious, but they can obviously handle it. But now the question they ask is why are they inconvenienced as another party (China) is doing so much more? Why do they have to sacrifice while someone else is the bigger issue? And before I get yet another accusation that I'm anti climate change or whatever - I'm not. I'm explaining a very obvious reason why this is always an issue. It's because people don't like a scrimping and saving while their neighbor doesn't have to. If the green people can't get that through their heads then this debate will never be constructive.
- ac29 8y agoReducing demand for disposable goods that are likely manufactured in China would eliminate any pollution associated with its manufacture.
- thatoneuser 8y agoOK. You're still ignoring the problem that China pollutes way more. Us not buying their plastic crap doesn't change that.