9 ms·

I disagree that not everyone needs work/life balance. If you're a leader at a company, your employees count on you to make good decisions regarding their futur

by codypo 16y ago

I disagree that not everyone needs work/life balance. If you're a leader at a company, your employees count on you to make good decisions regarding their future. I don't think you can make reasonable decisions here if you spend all of your time working and thus lose the perspective one gains from an outside life. Let's say that I'm an employee of yours and I have a pregnant wife. I wish to take off at 3 PM once a week to accompany her to the doctor. I make this pitch to you, my 21 year old CEO who lives at the office. If you're buried in the business all day, every day, could you comprehend how important something like this would be to me? Even if you did say yes, what would you think of my commitment to the company? Would you factor my behavior into your decisions about my future? You may find great meaning within your work, but others will have much different priorities in their lives. I think you lose your ability to realize that with this sort of workload.

lkrubner 16y ago
My remark may be dismissed as trolling, but seriously think about the scenario you are putting forward: "Let's say that I'm an employee of yours and I have a pregnant wife. I wish to take off at 3 PM once a week to accompany her to the doctor. I make this pitch to you, my 21 year old CEO who lives at the office." This is at a startup? The early phase of a startup is short - within 2 years the company either takes off or dies. I really, seriously think that if you and your wife want to have children, you should get a job at a larger and more stable organization - its good for your kid, good for your wife, good for you. If you have a pregnant wife, you should not be working at a startup. Find something more stable and secure.
- jeffclark 16y ago
  I'd like to buy enough downvotes to make this comment disappear forever. A startup is still a job, and a job is still only part of your life. There are jobs before and jobs after, but nobody lays on their deathbed wishing they would have spent _less_ time with their family.
  - run4yourlives 16y ago
    And kill the discussion? That's awesome. The point is valid even if it is flawed, you and the others that downvoted should be upvoting it, then providing your counter argument.
  - deleted 16y ago
    [deleted]
  - lkrubner 16y ago
    You would like for my comment to disappear forever? I find it worrisome that your attitude exists on Hacker News. This is suppose to be a forum for frank, honest discussions about the life of entrepreneurs. I think my point is valid: the early phase of a startup is uniquely stressful. That should not be the part of your life that overlaps with having a child. We are talking about maybe 2 or 3 years of your life, or maybe 4 at a stretch. Why not have kids before that, or after that? Why have kids just then, during what you know will be the most stressful years of your whole life? I'd be curious to know what your reasoning is. Of course, if you can buy enough down votes to make my comment disappear forever, then you won't need to address the point that I raise.
    - jeffclark 16y ago
      Because your comment reeks of "startup romanticism", not startup practice. The most successful "Startup Guys™" that I know aren't the ones that spend 23 hours at the office and an hour commuting. They're the same guys that appreciate you staying late, but understand the importance of a life outside of their project and encourage you to get out of the office. It is unhealthy for you and it is unhealthy for your company. What's the point of being the boss if you can't take advantage of being the boss? Having enough money to live on an island is worthless if you don't get to spend any time on the island.
      - lkrubner 16y ago
        You write: "Because your comment reeks of "startup romanticism", not startup practice." Surely you realize that I could make the same kind of assertion about what you have written? I could write: "You comment reeks of sentimental notions about family life, not the actual reality of family life." If you want to argue that all people, everywhere, enjoy their families then you are simply in denial of reality. If you want to deny the fact that some people are deeply bitter about the sacrifices they have made for their children, then you are simply running away from the truth. As for the startup romanticism that you mention, I've been working with startups since 2002, which is long enough to have some idea about what habits work over the long term, and what habits do not work over the long term. From what I've seen, it is a bad idea to have a child during the first 2 or 3 years of a startup. You can have kids before then, or after then, but not right during the most intense phase of the startup.
- codypo 16y ago
  The scenario I put forward is my current scenario. My wife is due tomorrow (yippee!), I've been to nearly all of the doctor's appointments with her, and I'm cofounder of a startup that's doing quite well. Sure, I put in plenty of hours, but I never forget the importance of work/life balance. My company is important, but it's not all important.
  - portman 16y ago
    A hearty congratulations to you and your family. And don't worry about the parent-haters here on HN. I had hoped that the anti-childrearing bias would disappear after Paul and Jessica's baby, but that hasn't seemed to have any effect. I hope everything goes well with the delivery and that you continue to find time for balance in your startup life.
    - codypo 16y ago
      Thanks. Much appreciated!
Locke1689 16y ago
Everyone has work/life balance. The difference is exactly where each person draws a line between work and life. It seems that Seth prefers to include much of what we would think of as "work" as life. I find most of these comments on HN especially funny because most of my non-HN friends would find this group of people positively anti-social. They would find the very notion of obsessively commenting on a startup site with a group of people who have never met pretty pathetic, to be honest. Their idea of socializing is getting drunk at a club and finding some hot girl to go home with for the night. Honestly, sometimes that's my idea of socializing, too. Does that make them more "social" than this crowd? No. Is HN's socializing any better? Of course not. I'm really depressed at the amount of judgmental bullshit that this thread has to spawned, to be honest. People need to understand that others may not be like them and may not make the same life choices. Does that make their choices inherently worse? No. It may also mean that they have different goals. Given that Seth and his company seem to be doing OK it looks like his choices are working for the company and, moreover, he understands his market and his employees.

by codypo 16y ago

lkrubner 16y ago

My remark may be dismissed as trolling, but seriously think about the scenario you are putting forward: "Let's say that I'm an employee of yours and I have a pregnant wife. I wish to take off at 3 PM once a week to accompany her to the doctor. I make this pitch to you, my 21 year old CEO who lives at the office." This is at a startup? The early phase of a startup is short - within 2 years the company either takes off or dies. I really, seriously think that if you and your wife want to have children, you should get a job at a larger and more stable organization - its good for your kid, good for your wife, good for you. If you have a pregnant wife, you should not be working at a startup. Find something more stable and secure.

jeffclark 16y ago
I'd like to buy enough downvotes to make this comment disappear forever. A startup is still a job, and a job is still only part of your life. There are jobs before and jobs after, but nobody lays on their deathbed wishing they would have spent _less_ time with their family.
- run4yourlives 16y ago
  And kill the discussion? That's awesome. The point is valid even if it is flawed, you and the others that downvoted should be upvoting it, then providing your counter argument.
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]
- lkrubner 16y ago
  You would like for my comment to disappear forever? I find it worrisome that your attitude exists on Hacker News. This is suppose to be a forum for frank, honest discussions about the life of entrepreneurs. I think my point is valid: the early phase of a startup is uniquely stressful. That should not be the part of your life that overlaps with having a child. We are talking about maybe 2 or 3 years of your life, or maybe 4 at a stretch. Why not have kids before that, or after that? Why have kids just then, during what you know will be the most stressful years of your whole life? I'd be curious to know what your reasoning is. Of course, if you can buy enough down votes to make my comment disappear forever, then you won't need to address the point that I raise.
  - jeffclark 16y ago
    Because your comment reeks of "startup romanticism", not startup practice. The most successful "Startup Guys™" that I know aren't the ones that spend 23 hours at the office and an hour commuting. They're the same guys that appreciate you staying late, but understand the importance of a life outside of their project and encourage you to get out of the office. It is unhealthy for you and it is unhealthy for your company. What's the point of being the boss if you can't take advantage of being the boss? Having enough money to live on an island is worthless if you don't get to spend any time on the island.
    - lkrubner 16y ago
      You write: "Because your comment reeks of "startup romanticism", not startup practice." Surely you realize that I could make the same kind of assertion about what you have written? I could write: "You comment reeks of sentimental notions about family life, not the actual reality of family life." If you want to argue that all people, everywhere, enjoy their families then you are simply in denial of reality. If you want to deny the fact that some people are deeply bitter about the sacrifices they have made for their children, then you are simply running away from the truth. As for the startup romanticism that you mention, I've been working with startups since 2002, which is long enough to have some idea about what habits work over the long term, and what habits do not work over the long term. From what I've seen, it is a bad idea to have a child during the first 2 or 3 years of a startup. You can have kids before then, or after then, but not right during the most intense phase of the startup.
codypo 16y ago
The scenario I put forward is my current scenario. My wife is due tomorrow (yippee!), I've been to nearly all of the doctor's appointments with her, and I'm cofounder of a startup that's doing quite well. Sure, I put in plenty of hours, but I never forget the importance of work/life balance. My company is important, but it's not all important.
- portman 16y ago
  A hearty congratulations to you and your family. And don't worry about the parent-haters here on HN. I had hoped that the anti-childrearing bias would disappear after Paul and Jessica's baby, but that hasn't seemed to have any effect. I hope everything goes well with the delivery and that you continue to find time for balance in your startup life.
  - codypo 16y ago
    Thanks. Much appreciated!

Locke1689 16y ago

Everyone has work/life balance. The difference is exactly where each person draws a line between work and life. It seems that Seth prefers to include much of what we would think of as "work" as life. I find most of these comments on HN especially funny because most of my non-HN friends would find this group of people positively anti-social. They would find the very notion of obsessively commenting on a startup site with a group of people who have never met pretty pathetic, to be honest. Their idea of socializing is getting drunk at a club and finding some hot girl to go home with for the night. Honestly, sometimes that's my idea of socializing, too. Does that make them more "social" than this crowd? No. Is HN's socializing any better? Of course not. I'm really depressed at the amount of judgmental bullshit that this thread has to spawned, to be honest. People need to understand that others may not be like them and may not make the same life choices. Does that make their choices inherently worse? No. It may also mean that they have different goals. Given that Seth and his company seem to be doing OK it looks like his choices are working for the company and, moreover, he understands his market and his employees.