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> receiving attaboys and cover from the Oval Office I don't recall of any incident where the President congratulated a white nationalist terrorist or said anyt

> receiving attaboys and cover from the Oval Office I don't recall of any incident where the President congratulated a white nationalist terrorist or said anything that could even be conceived as such, do you have a source for this?

harrumph 8y ago
... “Good people on ‘both sides’?”
- Macross8299 8y ago
  Context matters. Was he saying that referring to the "terrorist vs innocent people" or "protesters vs counter-protesters" in context of the Charlottesville protest where the terrorist incident occurred? It's a gaffe for sure but I don't think the intention was to congratulate a terrorist.
  - harrumph 8y ago
    You think “both sides” is somehow unclear as to what is meant by “both”? Let me thank god I’m not your manager.
    - Macross8299 8y ago
      Look at the original quote you're citing [0]: >"I’ve condemned neo-Nazis. I’ve condemned many different groups. But not all of those people were neo-Nazis, believe me," Trump said. "You also had some very fine people on both sides," I can't even read this as him saying there are fine white nationalists, let alone him saying that white nationalist terrorists are fine. [0]: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/08/trump-defends-white-nationalist-protesters-some-very-fine-people-on-both-sides/537012/ https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/08/trump-d...
      - fzeroracer 8y ago
        You can't say you condemn neo-Nazis in the same breath that you praise a white supremacist rally for having good people. A white supremacist rally that resulted in people being killed and seriously injured. A rally where the people yelled 'the Jews will not replace us', waved Nazi flags and more. Who were the 'very fine people' on the side of the neo-Nazi rally?
        Macross8299 8y ago
        The most charitable interpretation is that Trump thought it was originally a rally in defense of the Robert E. Lee statue and was hijacked for neo-Nazi purposes. I guess you could make the argument that not wanting a statue of Robert E Lee removed inherently makes you a neo-Nazi, but I don't think that necessarily follows.
- MockObject 8y ago
  I can't imagine fainter praise, frankly.
  - harrumph 8y ago
    > I can’t imagine fainter praise. Thanks for correctly identifying “good people” as praise (for a vehicular murderer plus a guy firing a pistol into a crowd).
- smsm42 8y ago
  Fake news much? This quote related to people defending and opposing confederate monuments, not white nationalists. If you read even one more line of the quote, it becomes immediately clear: “You had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists,” Trump said. “The press has treated them absolutely unfairly.” “You also had some very fine people on both sides,” he said. Surely you can see, that "neo-Nazis and white nationalists" is one category, but "other than" is another, and "also very fine people" does not relate to white nationalists - it specifically excludes white nationalists, mentioning it as distinct group. That is immediately clear from reading just two lines of context.
  - harrumph 8y ago
    > This quote related to people defending and opposing confederate monuments, not white nationalists. If this tortured, senseless interpretation is any example of your technique to differentiate between semantic objects in your software work, remind me to never, ever push your code to production without a shitload of extra testing.
    - smsm42 8y ago
      I read the actual speech: https://www.vox.com/2017/8/15/16154028/trump-press-conference-transcript-charlottesville https://www.vox.com/2017/8/15/16154028/trump-press-conferenc... It says, black on white: "You had people and i'm not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists. They should be condemned totally. You had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists.". I conclude that if he says "I am not talking about neo-Nazis and white nationalists" that means he is not talking about neo-Nazis and white nationalists. You call it "tortured, senseless interpretation". I sincerely hope I never, ever will be in a position where you would review code that I need to get into production. Because I can only imagine what you'd see in a moderately complex code if you can't understand a simple phrase like "I'm not talking about X".
      - harrumph 8y ago
        > Because I can only imagine what you'd see in a moderately complex code if you can't understand a simple phrase like "I'm not talking about X" I grant you could imagine it, as your imagination is robust! You have somehow imagined that one meaningful category grouping exists here in spite of the fact that we all have eyes and can see actual events that took place that make it abundantly clear the grouping does not in any way exist. It is nothing less than a triumph of purest imagination when anyone states that in Charlottesville, separate from those white nationalists marching, rioting, firing guns into crowds, chanting Nazi slogans, carrying torches...we found a blameless group fairly described as "good people"...marching...alongside. Seriously, you're fired. Pack up your shit and get out. Around here we need people whose cognitive and ethical standards exceed the low bar set by Donald Trump.
- factsaresacred 8y ago
  Full quote: > "you had some very bad people in that group. But you also had people that were very fine people on both sides. You had people in that group – excuse me, excuse me. I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down, of to them, a very, very important statue...and I'm not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists, because they should be condemned totally – but you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists, okay?" It's clear as day that he condemned the neo-Nazis.

harrumph 8y ago

... “Good people on ‘both sides’?”

Macross8299 8y ago
Context matters. Was he saying that referring to the "terrorist vs innocent people" or "protesters vs counter-protesters" in context of the Charlottesville protest where the terrorist incident occurred? It's a gaffe for sure but I don't think the intention was to congratulate a terrorist.
- harrumph 8y ago
  You think “both sides” is somehow unclear as to what is meant by “both”? Let me thank god I’m not your manager.
  - Macross8299 8y ago
    Look at the original quote you're citing [0]: >"I’ve condemned neo-Nazis. I’ve condemned many different groups. But not all of those people were neo-Nazis, believe me," Trump said. "You also had some very fine people on both sides," I can't even read this as him saying there are fine white nationalists, let alone him saying that white nationalist terrorists are fine. [0]: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/08/trump-defends-white-nationalist-protesters-some-very-fine-people-on-both-sides/537012/ https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/08/trump-d...
    - fzeroracer 8y ago
      You can't say you condemn neo-Nazis in the same breath that you praise a white supremacist rally for having good people. A white supremacist rally that resulted in people being killed and seriously injured. A rally where the people yelled 'the Jews will not replace us', waved Nazi flags and more. Who were the 'very fine people' on the side of the neo-Nazi rally?
      - Macross8299 8y ago
        The most charitable interpretation is that Trump thought it was originally a rally in defense of the Robert E. Lee statue and was hijacked for neo-Nazi purposes. I guess you could make the argument that not wanting a statue of Robert E Lee removed inherently makes you a neo-Nazi, but I don't think that necessarily follows.
MockObject 8y ago
I can't imagine fainter praise, frankly.
- harrumph 8y ago
  > I can’t imagine fainter praise. Thanks for correctly identifying “good people” as praise (for a vehicular murderer plus a guy firing a pistol into a crowd).
smsm42 8y ago
Fake news much? This quote related to people defending and opposing confederate monuments, not white nationalists. If you read even one more line of the quote, it becomes immediately clear: “You had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists,” Trump said. “The press has treated them absolutely unfairly.” “You also had some very fine people on both sides,” he said. Surely you can see, that "neo-Nazis and white nationalists" is one category, but "other than" is another, and "also very fine people" does not relate to white nationalists - it specifically excludes white nationalists, mentioning it as distinct group. That is immediately clear from reading just two lines of context.
- harrumph 8y ago
  > This quote related to people defending and opposing confederate monuments, not white nationalists. If this tortured, senseless interpretation is any example of your technique to differentiate between semantic objects in your software work, remind me to never, ever push your code to production without a shitload of extra testing.
  - smsm42 8y ago
    I read the actual speech: https://www.vox.com/2017/8/15/16154028/trump-press-conference-transcript-charlottesville https://www.vox.com/2017/8/15/16154028/trump-press-conferenc... It says, black on white: "You had people and i'm not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists. They should be condemned totally. You had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists.". I conclude that if he says "I am not talking about neo-Nazis and white nationalists" that means he is not talking about neo-Nazis and white nationalists. You call it "tortured, senseless interpretation". I sincerely hope I never, ever will be in a position where you would review code that I need to get into production. Because I can only imagine what you'd see in a moderately complex code if you can't understand a simple phrase like "I'm not talking about X".
    - harrumph 8y ago
      > Because I can only imagine what you'd see in a moderately complex code if you can't understand a simple phrase like "I'm not talking about X" I grant you could imagine it, as your imagination is robust! You have somehow imagined that one meaningful category grouping exists here in spite of the fact that we all have eyes and can see actual events that took place that make it abundantly clear the grouping does not in any way exist. It is nothing less than a triumph of purest imagination when anyone states that in Charlottesville, separate from those white nationalists marching, rioting, firing guns into crowds, chanting Nazi slogans, carrying torches...we found a blameless group fairly described as "good people"...marching...alongside. Seriously, you're fired. Pack up your shit and get out. Around here we need people whose cognitive and ethical standards exceed the low bar set by Donald Trump.
factsaresacred 8y ago
Full quote: > "you had some very bad people in that group. But you also had people that were very fine people on both sides. You had people in that group – excuse me, excuse me. I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down, of to them, a very, very important statue...and I'm not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists, because they should be condemned totally – but you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists, okay?" It's clear as day that he condemned the neo-Nazis.