4 ms·

Right... I mean, they said MULTIPLE times that it would have multiplayer. Not just an implication, but straight up saying "you could encounter other players, bu

by 013a 8y ago

Right... I mean, they said MULTIPLE times that it would have multiplayer. Not just an implication, but straight up saying "you could encounter other players, but the likelihood is so tiny because of the size of what we're building" and that "you can't see yourself, so the only way to know what you look like is for someone else to see you" (these are direct quotes from Sean Murray, not paraphrasing). The box even had an ESRB rating for multiplayer that was covered up with a sticker for one that didn't rate it for multiplayer, at release. They said you could grief other players. They said you could customize the look of your player. They said you could land on comets. They said the animals eat each other. They said you wouldn't have to ever gather resources if you wanted (which I guess is technically true if you're alright with also doing absolutely nothing else the game has to offer beside walking around on your starting planet). I guess you could argue that these were all some sort of vision of a "future state" and not representative of day 1, but there certainly weren't any qualifications added to the statement in any of his interviews, and there's plenty of evidence that they actually intended this stuff to be in on day 1 but simply didn't have the time. Which is fine! And I think we should praise them for committing to turning it into a game that is actually amazing. But they definitely did betray a lot of players at launch. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8P2CZg3sJQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8P2CZg3sJQ

gilgoomesh 8y ago
I always get annoyed when I see people repeat the quote "you could encounter other players, but the likelihood is so tiny" as though he was promising see-your-friends-multiplayer. The context of that quote was that Sean was explaining why the game had multiplayer elements like naming rights for discoveries in a shared universe but the gameplay was primary about solo exploration. It was clear that he wanted to push the benefits of "shared universe" as a form of multiplayer but as for literally seeing your friends, he was trying to say "we could code it into the game but we think it's too unlikely so we won't". It's obvious that Murray has problems directly saying no. He repeatedly said "rare", meaning "never". That was his crime.
- Rebelgecko 8y ago
  Is "See your friends" not what he actually promised?[1] Rare certainly doesn't mean never. In another interview, he said players running into each other will be rare but will be less rare if more players buy the game, which doesn't make since if the probability of this happening is always 0. Even after the game came out he kept up the charade. When two players on the same planet couldn't see each other he made evasive comments about server load[2]. [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqeN6hj4dZU&t=5m41s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqeN6hj4dZU&t=5m41s [2]: https://twitter.com/nomanssky/status/763271005003538432 https://twitter.com/nomanssky/status/763271005003538432
- 013a 8y ago
  You can spin it however you want in your head, but the evidence is overwhelming: they intended this game to be a true multiplayer experience very early in development. They intended to have it done by release. As the release cycle went on and Sean did more interviews, it became subtly clear that he was trying to control expectations, by saying things like "we want it to be an experience like Dark Souls or Journey", which implies a sort of "humans are here but you never see them" atmosphere (moreso Dark Souls than Journey). But that didn't stop other comments from him, like clearly saying that other players would be able to see your character, nor did it stop the box from being printed with an Online Play ESRB rating before being redacted with a rating that didn't have that. In the best case, I'm fine with believing the best of everyone involved; that this was Hello Games' first game, that Sean firmly believed they could get everything done by release, and then, as it always does, the reality of software development hits. I think that's very likely what happened. So calling their actions "lies" is very strong language; moreso simply broken promises. But, at the same time: we can't simply allow game developers to promise the universe and then not hold them accountable when they can't deliver, because that line between "assume the best, they're new at this" and "trying to drive pre-order sales despite knowing the game is shit" is very gray, and very hard to identify when all the information we often have to go on is their word.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

by 013a 8y ago

gilgoomesh 8y ago

I always get annoyed when I see people repeat the quote "you could encounter other players, but the likelihood is so tiny" as though he was promising see-your-friends-multiplayer. The context of that quote was that Sean was explaining why the game had multiplayer elements like naming rights for discoveries in a shared universe but the gameplay was primary about solo exploration. It was clear that he wanted to push the benefits of "shared universe" as a form of multiplayer but as for literally seeing your friends, he was trying to say "we could code it into the game but we think it's too unlikely so we won't". It's obvious that Murray has problems directly saying no. He repeatedly said "rare", meaning "never". That was his crime.

Rebelgecko 8y ago
Is "See your friends" not what he actually promised?[1] Rare certainly doesn't mean never. In another interview, he said players running into each other will be rare but will be less rare if more players buy the game, which doesn't make since if the probability of this happening is always 0. Even after the game came out he kept up the charade. When two players on the same planet couldn't see each other he made evasive comments about server load[2]. [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqeN6hj4dZU&t=5m41s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqeN6hj4dZU&t=5m41s [2]: https://twitter.com/nomanssky/status/763271005003538432 https://twitter.com/nomanssky/status/763271005003538432
013a 8y ago
You can spin it however you want in your head, but the evidence is overwhelming: they intended this game to be a true multiplayer experience very early in development. They intended to have it done by release. As the release cycle went on and Sean did more interviews, it became subtly clear that he was trying to control expectations, by saying things like "we want it to be an experience like Dark Souls or Journey", which implies a sort of "humans are here but you never see them" atmosphere (moreso Dark Souls than Journey). But that didn't stop other comments from him, like clearly saying that other players would be able to see your character, nor did it stop the box from being printed with an Online Play ESRB rating before being redacted with a rating that didn't have that. In the best case, I'm fine with believing the best of everyone involved; that this was Hello Games' first game, that Sean firmly believed they could get everything done by release, and then, as it always does, the reality of software development hits. I think that's very likely what happened. So calling their actions "lies" is very strong language; moreso simply broken promises. But, at the same time: we can't simply allow game developers to promise the universe and then not hold them accountable when they can't deliver, because that line between "assume the best, they're new at this" and "trying to drive pre-order sales despite knowing the game is shit" is very gray, and very hard to identify when all the information we often have to go on is their word.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]