4 ms·

I would bet that mercury toxicity is incredibly underdiagnosed, especially if it's not acute. Fatigue, insomnia, and a host of other symptoms are fairly common

by chmln 8y ago

I would bet that mercury toxicity is incredibly underdiagnosed, especially if it's not acute. Fatigue, insomnia, and a host of other symptoms are fairly common and not easy to spot as a part of a bigger problem. Anecdata: when I went to a large hospital they laughed off my idea that I have heavy metal poisoning and didn't even have the facilities to test for it. Only months later after visiting a naturopath and getting tested did my suspicions get confirmed. This case will never be on any official health records.

omalleyt 8y ago
What was the treatment?
- joenathanone 8y ago
  >heavy metal poisoning Only treatment I'm aware of is some light jazz or R&B.
- cogman10 8y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_metal_detoxification https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_metal_detoxification Dialysis and depending on the metal Chelation. Both suck and neither were likely prescribed by a naturopath.
Alex3917 8y ago
It's actually common in startup founders who sell their startups and then start eating expensive sushi all the time. My understanding is that several billionaires in silicon valley have mild Parkinson's-like tremors because of this.
- nubbins 8y ago
  High end omakase meals generally come with 1 or 2 .5 oz pieces of tuna. Even at 3x a day it would be comparable to one can of tuna. Of course mercury varies heavily from fish to fish but unless they were living on tuna/swordfish this sounds like an urban legend or could be something else in raw fish like liver parasites or bacteria.
  - Alex3917 8y ago
    > Even at 3x a day it would be comparable to one can of tuna. The amount of mercury in the type of fatty tuna used for sushi is several times more mercury than in light canned tuna, which is normally what you'd use for a tuna melt or whatever. Sushi grade tuna (unlike eel) isn't one of the types of fish you should never eat, but I definitely wouldn't eat it more than once a month.
  - fencepost 8y ago
    Sushi-grade tuna and I suspect tuna steaks are much more likely to be from the larger tuna species. At the very high end you get the special cases where truly massive fish are sold at auction for absurd prices - the same fish that got to that size by eating a huge number of smaller fish and thus concentrating mercury. Canned "solid" albacore or "white" tuna has the same issue, though I wouldn't be surprised if it was still lower than fish sold for sushi or steaks. Chunk "light" tuna on the other hand tends to come from smaller species and pretty much as a direct consequence has lower mercury levels. Based on the numbers in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_in_fish https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_in_fish, canned light tuna and skipjack have 1/3 to 1/2 the mercury found in albacore and yellowfin tuna and 1/4 the levels found in bigeye. Notably, those 3 all run 2-10x the size of the smaller species used in "chunk light."
soared 8y ago
> Naturopathy or naturopathic medicine is a form of alternative medicine that employs an array of pseudoscientific practices branded as "natural", "non-invasive", and as promoting "self-healing". The ideology and methods of naturopathy are based on vitalism and folk medicine, rather than evidence-based medicine.
- chmln 8y ago
  This wasn't my experience. Where my family doctor and other practitioners ignored my thoughts and refused to get me tested out of personal skepticism, my ND listened to me and provided appropriate means of testing. At no point was I suggested sketchy ancient 'healing' methods.
  - tdeck 8y ago
    There are all kinds of branches to alternative medicine. One niche is the "ancient" style treatments you describe. Another is homeopathy. Another is various electrical and medical devices. And still another is an industry trying to sell chelation therapy to people who don't need it. Obviously I'm not a doctor and not familiar with your case, but that might be what others are responding to (e.g. https://www.acsh.org/news/2017/08/08/chelation-therapy-fad-treatment-real-risks-11667 https://www.acsh.org/news/2017/08/08/chelation-therapy-fad-t...) It's not surprising that they listened to you and provided treatment, the entire brand of naturopathy/alternative medicine is based on making the patient feel heard and then telling the patient what they want to hear, which is "I can help you", whether or not it's actually true.
cogman10 8y ago
https://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/Tests/heavy_metal.html https://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/Tests/hea... Naturopathy (like most pseudo sciences) thrives on taking things undiagnosed and giving concrete answers. There likely isn't a person out there that wouldn't test positive for heavy metal poisoning. Go retest with a different naturopath. I'm almost certain you'll still test positive (even though they likely gave you a bunch of vitamins and herbs to cure your poisoning). > Fatigue, insomnia, and a host of other symptoms are fairly common and not easy to spot as a part of a bigger problem. Fatigue and insomnia are depression symptoms. I'm not a doctor, but have you considered talking to a therapist?
- chmln 8y ago
  I'm not sure what you're basing your opinion on, but I wasn't directly tested by a naturopath. You get a urine sample that's later shipped to an accredited lab and they provide you a detailed report with reference ranges, recommendations, and caveats. I don't know what other NDs are like, though I'm sure many make a living by overselling supplements.
  - cogman10 8y ago
    > accredited lab Accredited by who? > detailed report with reference ranges, recommendations, and caveats. I can generate detailed reports. With references and ranges. My point still stands, if you think what they are perscribing works, go get tested again with a different lab. More than likely you'll have just as negative a report come back with exactly the same recommendations. Naturopathy is pseudoscience.
    - chmln 8y ago
      Seems like you got an axe to grind, but I'll bite. This is the lab in my case: http://rmalab.com/about-us/accreditation http://rmalab.com/about-us/accreditation > Naturopathy is pseudoscience Agreed. However, many NDs are not exactly "naturopathic", but more like alternative doctors that can fill in the gaps if your conventional MD is not very helpful.

by chmln 8y ago

omalleyt 8y ago

What was the treatment?

joenathanone 8y ago
>heavy metal poisoning Only treatment I'm aware of is some light jazz or R&B.
cogman10 8y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_metal_detoxification https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_metal_detoxification Dialysis and depending on the metal Chelation. Both suck and neither were likely prescribed by a naturopath.

Alex3917 8y ago

It's actually common in startup founders who sell their startups and then start eating expensive sushi all the time. My understanding is that several billionaires in silicon valley have mild Parkinson's-like tremors because of this.

nubbins 8y ago
High end omakase meals generally come with 1 or 2 .5 oz pieces of tuna. Even at 3x a day it would be comparable to one can of tuna. Of course mercury varies heavily from fish to fish but unless they were living on tuna/swordfish this sounds like an urban legend or could be something else in raw fish like liver parasites or bacteria.
- Alex3917 8y ago
  > Even at 3x a day it would be comparable to one can of tuna. The amount of mercury in the type of fatty tuna used for sushi is several times more mercury than in light canned tuna, which is normally what you'd use for a tuna melt or whatever. Sushi grade tuna (unlike eel) isn't one of the types of fish you should never eat, but I definitely wouldn't eat it more than once a month.
- fencepost 8y ago
  Sushi-grade tuna and I suspect tuna steaks are much more likely to be from the larger tuna species. At the very high end you get the special cases where truly massive fish are sold at auction for absurd prices - the same fish that got to that size by eating a huge number of smaller fish and thus concentrating mercury. Canned "solid" albacore or "white" tuna has the same issue, though I wouldn't be surprised if it was still lower than fish sold for sushi or steaks. Chunk "light" tuna on the other hand tends to come from smaller species and pretty much as a direct consequence has lower mercury levels. Based on the numbers in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_in_fish https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_in_fish, canned light tuna and skipjack have 1/3 to 1/2 the mercury found in albacore and yellowfin tuna and 1/4 the levels found in bigeye. Notably, those 3 all run 2-10x the size of the smaller species used in "chunk light."

soared 8y ago

> Naturopathy or naturopathic medicine is a form of alternative medicine that employs an array of pseudoscientific practices branded as "natural", "non-invasive", and as promoting "self-healing". The ideology and methods of naturopathy are based on vitalism and folk medicine, rather than evidence-based medicine.

chmln 8y ago
This wasn't my experience. Where my family doctor and other practitioners ignored my thoughts and refused to get me tested out of personal skepticism, my ND listened to me and provided appropriate means of testing. At no point was I suggested sketchy ancient 'healing' methods.
- tdeck 8y ago
  There are all kinds of branches to alternative medicine. One niche is the "ancient" style treatments you describe. Another is homeopathy. Another is various electrical and medical devices. And still another is an industry trying to sell chelation therapy to people who don't need it. Obviously I'm not a doctor and not familiar with your case, but that might be what others are responding to (e.g. https://www.acsh.org/news/2017/08/08/chelation-therapy-fad-treatment-real-risks-11667 https://www.acsh.org/news/2017/08/08/chelation-therapy-fad-t...) It's not surprising that they listened to you and provided treatment, the entire brand of naturopathy/alternative medicine is based on making the patient feel heard and then telling the patient what they want to hear, which is "I can help you", whether or not it's actually true.

cogman10 8y ago

https://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/Tests/heavy_metal.html https://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/Tests/hea... Naturopathy (like most pseudo sciences) thrives on taking things undiagnosed and giving concrete answers. There likely isn't a person out there that wouldn't test positive for heavy metal poisoning. Go retest with a different naturopath. I'm almost certain you'll still test positive (even though they likely gave you a bunch of vitamins and herbs to cure your poisoning). > Fatigue, insomnia, and a host of other symptoms are fairly common and not easy to spot as a part of a bigger problem. Fatigue and insomnia are depression symptoms. I'm not a doctor, but have you considered talking to a therapist?

chmln 8y ago
I'm not sure what you're basing your opinion on, but I wasn't directly tested by a naturopath. You get a urine sample that's later shipped to an accredited lab and they provide you a detailed report with reference ranges, recommendations, and caveats. I don't know what other NDs are like, though I'm sure many make a living by overselling supplements.
- cogman10 8y ago
  > accredited lab Accredited by who? > detailed report with reference ranges, recommendations, and caveats. I can generate detailed reports. With references and ranges. My point still stands, if you think what they are perscribing works, go get tested again with a different lab. More than likely you'll have just as negative a report come back with exactly the same recommendations. Naturopathy is pseudoscience.
  - chmln 8y ago
    Seems like you got an axe to grind, but I'll bite. This is the lab in my case: http://rmalab.com/about-us/accreditation http://rmalab.com/about-us/accreditation > Naturopathy is pseudoscience Agreed. However, many NDs are not exactly "naturopathic", but more like alternative doctors that can fill in the gaps if your conventional MD is not very helpful.