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100k gross in Berlin is about 60k net assuming private healthcare insurance. Say you spend 10k a year on rent + utilities, which is very optimistic for someone

100k gross in Berlin is about 60k net assuming private healthcare insurance. Say you spend 10k a year on rent + utilities, which is very optimistic for someone that would move to Berlin in 2019. 160k gross in Zürich is ~115k after social contributions and taxes. Let's assume 5k for health insurance and 25k on rent a year. You're still 30k CHF ahead in Zürich. I don't see how these salaries are comparable.

krn 8y ago
> You're still 30k CHF ahead in Zürich. I don't see how these salaries are comparable. How? Because everything costs twice as much in Zurich. You can afford a way more with 50k / year in Berlin than with 80k / year in Zurich.
- hocuspocus 8y ago
  First, not everything costs twice as much, far from that. Big expenses are going to be similar, or even cheaper due to the lower VAT. Electronics, vehicles, transportation, travel/vacation, broadband... there are really plenty of items in my budget that are more significant than the price of a liter of milk. And again, assuming people are spending their entire income is completely ridiculous. You can deny reality all you want, but anyone who's lived in both countries will confirm what I'm saying.
  - seppel 8y ago
    > And again, assuming people are spending their entire income is completely ridiculous. Indeed. This only applies to low income households. If you are a software engeneer, COL no longer matters that much, because you only spend maybe a third of your income locally. Thus the net income matters much more. This is also why people usually move from low to high COL areas and not the other way around.
  - krn 8y ago
    > Big expenses are going to be similar, or even cheaper due to the lower VAT. Electronics, vehicles, transportation, travel/vacation, broadband... These are not big expenses. Buying real estate is. And the price per square meter in Zurich is twice higher than in Berlin, making the difference in salary neglectable. It's obvious that working in Switzerland makes buying things produced in the rest of the world look cheaper. But if a house in Zurich costs 1 mln, and a house in Berlin costs 0.5 mln, one needs to work no less to be able to afford it. Therefore, someone making 100k in Berlin can easily have a similar quality of life as someone making 160-200k in Zurich.
    - TomMarius 8y ago
      Do you really need to buy real estate in Zurich? You can work in Zurich and buy real estate in Prague. Btw it's a 35 min train ride from Zurich to a German town with a supermarket that has German prices. There are people going there with cars (40 min drive) and bringing back stuff for friends.
      - deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
    - seppel 8y ago
      > And the price per square meter in Zurich is twice higher than in Berlin, making the difference in salary neglectable. Housing is more expensive in Zürich than in Berlin. That's accepted but already was factored in: You will pay a higher rent or mortgage there. But nobody pays 100% of his salary for the apparment. At the end of the month, you will definitely have left more in our account of 200kCHF in Zürich than 100kEUR in Berlin.
- seppel 8y ago
  > How? Because everything costs twice as much in Zurich. Electronics/Computer stuff does not cost twice as much in Zürich, cars do not cost twice as much, and your vacation does not cost twice as much. Saving money cost the same as every else (captical tax might vary) so unless you retire in Zürich, you will end up with much more in your account. Plus the retirement plan in Switzerland in much better than in Germany.

krn 8y ago

> You're still 30k CHF ahead in Zürich. I don't see how these salaries are comparable. How? Because everything costs twice as much in Zurich. You can afford a way more with 50k / year in Berlin than with 80k / year in Zurich.

hocuspocus 8y ago
First, not everything costs twice as much, far from that. Big expenses are going to be similar, or even cheaper due to the lower VAT. Electronics, vehicles, transportation, travel/vacation, broadband... there are really plenty of items in my budget that are more significant than the price of a liter of milk. And again, assuming people are spending their entire income is completely ridiculous. You can deny reality all you want, but anyone who's lived in both countries will confirm what I'm saying.
- seppel 8y ago
  > And again, assuming people are spending their entire income is completely ridiculous. Indeed. This only applies to low income households. If you are a software engeneer, COL no longer matters that much, because you only spend maybe a third of your income locally. Thus the net income matters much more. This is also why people usually move from low to high COL areas and not the other way around.
- krn 8y ago
  > Big expenses are going to be similar, or even cheaper due to the lower VAT. Electronics, vehicles, transportation, travel/vacation, broadband... These are not big expenses. Buying real estate is. And the price per square meter in Zurich is twice higher than in Berlin, making the difference in salary neglectable. It's obvious that working in Switzerland makes buying things produced in the rest of the world look cheaper. But if a house in Zurich costs 1 mln, and a house in Berlin costs 0.5 mln, one needs to work no less to be able to afford it. Therefore, someone making 100k in Berlin can easily have a similar quality of life as someone making 160-200k in Zurich.
  - TomMarius 8y ago
    Do you really need to buy real estate in Zurich? You can work in Zurich and buy real estate in Prague. Btw it's a 35 min train ride from Zurich to a German town with a supermarket that has German prices. There are people going there with cars (40 min drive) and bringing back stuff for friends.
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
  - seppel 8y ago
    > And the price per square meter in Zurich is twice higher than in Berlin, making the difference in salary neglectable. Housing is more expensive in Zürich than in Berlin. That's accepted but already was factored in: You will pay a higher rent or mortgage there. But nobody pays 100% of his salary for the apparment. At the end of the month, you will definitely have left more in our account of 200kCHF in Zürich than 100kEUR in Berlin.
seppel 8y ago
> How? Because everything costs twice as much in Zurich. Electronics/Computer stuff does not cost twice as much in Zürich, cars do not cost twice as much, and your vacation does not cost twice as much. Saving money cost the same as every else (captical tax might vary) so unless you retire in Zürich, you will end up with much more in your account. Plus the retirement plan in Switzerland in much better than in Germany.