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These fifth wheels and class As can weigh up to 24000 pounds (even if they where never legally allowed to). A moving object at that weight would make a multi-st

These fifth wheels and class As can weigh up to 24000 pounds (even if they where never legally allowed to). A moving object at that weight would make a multi-story RV park an architecture/safety nightmare. I'm talking about east-bay area that still has space. Not sunnyvale. - Just checked out the ready player one images - holy mother of guacamole.

axaxs 8y ago
What about having ground level RV, and apartment/condo/business space on top? * And perhaps additional levels of parking for tenants.
ChuckMcM 8y ago
I agree they are heavy, and even more heavy than the bus chassis they are built on top of, but I see that as an engineering problem right? There are bus depot parking structures where unused commercial buses are parked. And my civil engineering friends are fond of saying that with enough steel and concrete you can hold up anything :-). So as a mental exercise in scaling density by going vertical, in my sketchbook using lot "sizes" that were similar to a KOA RV campground as a baseline (about 30' x 60' per space), an 8 story parking complex on a 5 acre lot could hold 250+ spaces. Ok, and the idea isn't even original, see this: https://99percentinvisible.org/article/mobile-home-skyscrapers-elusive-dream-vertical-urban-trailer-parks/ https://99percentinvisible.org/article/mobile-home-skyscrape...
- Kadin 8y ago
  It's certainly possible, but with a lot less steel and concrete you could just build walls and have, you know, apartments. My guess is it's easier to find investors for that, too. The only reason I can imagine a multi-storey RV park making sense would be to take advantage of some weird zoning quirk or something. But that's a lot of money to throw at what's effectively a legal vulnerability that will probably quickly be fixed.
  - ChuckMcM 8y ago
    I don't disagree, the changes that a multi-level RV park bring are a more flexible pricing structure, a lower cost facilities budget, and perhaps a lower cost maintenance load. From a cash flow perspective I started with parking garages as a business model. The typical 'monthly parking' type garage is a concrete and steel affair with sprinklers and elevators as its biggest operational expense, a bit more if you add an on-site office for an attendant to capture additional revenue from special events. All the space that requires maintenance in an apartment building that is 'non-apartment' doesn't exist in an RV park. You don't repaint or re-carpet, you don't send HVAC dollars on cooling or heating, Etc. My assumption (and I'm open minded about missing things) are that using the ratio of comparing of a traditional RV park to a one story apartment complex is a valid way to estimate expenses and cash flow. Then to extrapolate by adding additional layers to the RV park. There are also different tax treatments but I suspect that if the difference there appears to exploitable that it will be quickly changed. The biggest complaint about RV parks are that they are RV parks and they are an "eyesore". By enclosing the park you can improve the optics, and by increasing the density you grow the ROI relative to an apartment by the cost ratio. But is it a $5M project, a $10M project, or a $25M project that I don't know yet. And while a casual polling of city folks about which would they prefer, RV's parked on the street or parked in an externally attractive structure set aside for them, polls favorably, it isn't clear that is enough to get final approval.
    - pjeide 8y ago
      Put the RV parks underground and pump in fresh air and fiber-optic daylight.
  - pjeide 8y ago
    Put the apartment buildings above ground, and RV parks underground with fresh air pumped in and fiber-optic lighting carrying natural light down from the surface. Have elevators going from below ground, and from the apartments, to ground-level retail complexes and terrestrial activities. Then have underground hyperloop tunnels to connect the RV parks, so that you can go to sleep in your home and move it from city to city, and pop up above ground to enjoy local tourism.
wiredfool 8y ago
From an engineering perspective, cars and trucks aren’t that heavy, because their weight is spread over a large area, and they can’t squish together like humans. Roughly, you’re not going to get over 60psf with vehicle traffic or storage. People jammed together can be 200psf, as can library stacks, and indoor pools are potentially even worse.

axaxs 8y ago

What about having ground level RV, and apartment/condo/business space on top? * And perhaps additional levels of parking for tenants.

ChuckMcM 8y ago

I agree they are heavy, and even more heavy than the bus chassis they are built on top of, but I see that as an engineering problem right? There are bus depot parking structures where unused commercial buses are parked. And my civil engineering friends are fond of saying that with enough steel and concrete you can hold up anything :-). So as a mental exercise in scaling density by going vertical, in my sketchbook using lot "sizes" that were similar to a KOA RV campground as a baseline (about 30' x 60' per space), an 8 story parking complex on a 5 acre lot could hold 250+ spaces. Ok, and the idea isn't even original, see this: https://99percentinvisible.org/article/mobile-home-skyscrapers-elusive-dream-vertical-urban-trailer-parks/ https://99percentinvisible.org/article/mobile-home-skyscrape...

Kadin 8y ago
It's certainly possible, but with a lot less steel and concrete you could just build walls and have, you know, apartments. My guess is it's easier to find investors for that, too. The only reason I can imagine a multi-storey RV park making sense would be to take advantage of some weird zoning quirk or something. But that's a lot of money to throw at what's effectively a legal vulnerability that will probably quickly be fixed.
- ChuckMcM 8y ago
  I don't disagree, the changes that a multi-level RV park bring are a more flexible pricing structure, a lower cost facilities budget, and perhaps a lower cost maintenance load. From a cash flow perspective I started with parking garages as a business model. The typical 'monthly parking' type garage is a concrete and steel affair with sprinklers and elevators as its biggest operational expense, a bit more if you add an on-site office for an attendant to capture additional revenue from special events. All the space that requires maintenance in an apartment building that is 'non-apartment' doesn't exist in an RV park. You don't repaint or re-carpet, you don't send HVAC dollars on cooling or heating, Etc. My assumption (and I'm open minded about missing things) are that using the ratio of comparing of a traditional RV park to a one story apartment complex is a valid way to estimate expenses and cash flow. Then to extrapolate by adding additional layers to the RV park. There are also different tax treatments but I suspect that if the difference there appears to exploitable that it will be quickly changed. The biggest complaint about RV parks are that they are RV parks and they are an "eyesore". By enclosing the park you can improve the optics, and by increasing the density you grow the ROI relative to an apartment by the cost ratio. But is it a $5M project, a $10M project, or a $25M project that I don't know yet. And while a casual polling of city folks about which would they prefer, RV's parked on the street or parked in an externally attractive structure set aside for them, polls favorably, it isn't clear that is enough to get final approval.
  - pjeide 8y ago
    Put the RV parks underground and pump in fresh air and fiber-optic daylight.
- pjeide 8y ago
  Put the apartment buildings above ground, and RV parks underground with fresh air pumped in and fiber-optic lighting carrying natural light down from the surface. Have elevators going from below ground, and from the apartments, to ground-level retail complexes and terrestrial activities. Then have underground hyperloop tunnels to connect the RV parks, so that you can go to sleep in your home and move it from city to city, and pop up above ground to enjoy local tourism.

wiredfool 8y ago

From an engineering perspective, cars and trucks aren’t that heavy, because their weight is spread over a large area, and they can’t squish together like humans. Roughly, you’re not going to get over 60psf with vehicle traffic or storage. People jammed together can be 200psf, as can library stacks, and indoor pools are potentially even worse.