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Because the science is so solid that it's beating a dead horse at this point. But with anti-vaxxers, It's like telling someone the red apple you're holding is

Because the science is so solid that it's beating a dead horse at this point. But with anti-vaxxers, It's like telling someone the red apple you're holding is red, yet they insist that it's green. You can't argue "the merits" with people like this.

RobertRoberts 8y ago
Here's two medical doctors that say the science isn't settled at all. In fact that the vaccine usage in it's current form is anti-scientific. Dr. Richard Halvorsen (England) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMs1ue8j9CM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMs1ue8j9CM Dr. Suzanne Humphries (USA) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFQQOv-Oi6U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFQQOv-Oi6U
- tombert 8y ago
  There are over 1 million doctors in the US [1]. Of course you will be able to find one that supports nearly any ludicrous claim. There has been extensive research on vaccines in the major scientific literature, and the research has overwhelmingly reached the conclusion that there is no link with autism. [1] https://www.statista.com/topics/1244/physicians/ https://www.statista.com/topics/1244/physicians/
  - RobertRoberts 8y ago
    Dr. Humphries specifically addresses the issue of those 1 million doctors in her talk. Your argument is a logical fallacy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum
    - tombert 8y ago
      It's hardly an argument ad populum to say that the overwhelming amount of research says vaccines have no link to autism. That's simply asserting an undeniable fact Moreover, are you seriously asserting the argument of "because one doctor says something, it has to be right"? I'm sorry, but the scientific process trusts the research, simple as that, and I largely trust the scientific process. The argument isn't "I think vaccines are safe because most of the world says so", my argument is "in the overwhelming amount of research that has been done on this, it has determined no link between vaccines and autism".
      - RobertRoberts 8y ago
        The linked sources aren't saying "don't vaccinate", they are saying "weigh the risks". There is not a single scientific source anywhere that says vaccines have zero side effects and/or zero negative effects on _everyone_. (it's common knowledge that immune compromised people can't even take vaccines)
  - sathishmanohar 8y ago
    The science is not settled. There is more and more new data coming out everyday linking vaccines and autism. Here is a discussion about the data set from a pediatric hospital in America. The concerned Doctor Paul Thomas is not even against vaccines. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bjvjf4MnFqc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bjvjf4MnFqc In reply to tombert If you want to go over more than 1000 studies about vaccines published in established scientific journal get a copy of Neil Z Miller's book https://www.amazon.com/Vaccine-Safety-Concerned-Families-Practitioners/dp/188121737X https://www.amazon.com/Vaccine-Safety-Concerned-Families-Pra... For those who want a summary go through this video with references to studies https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoT10nxZrVo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoT10nxZrVo
    - tombert 8y ago
      Ok, can you please send me a paper from a reputable scientific journal? Any idiot can make a YouTube video claiming whatever the hell they want. Look at how big the flat-earth movement is on YouTube. If you link me to a paper in a peer-reviewed journal, I'd be happy to read it.
    - tombert 8y ago
      How about linking me to one study, in a peer reviewed journal.
  - esaym 8y ago
    >There has been extensive research on vaccines in the major scientific literature, You should probably look into said "research" and see who actually funded it. Finding research that was not directly funded by a pharmaceutical is quite rare.
- _underfl0w_ 8y ago
  You posted this same comment in another thread and were quickly fact-checked. Neither of those doctors have published anything peer-reviewed on the subject or in an adjacent field. Just because it's on YouTube doesn't mean it's accurate.
  - RobertRoberts 8y ago
    I wasn not presenting them as "doctors" as an authority, but the facts they present while being doctors. Do you believe that who they are as a person is more or less important than the facts they present?
    - dang 8y ago
      Please stop now. At this point you've crossed into trolling, and there's no way this discussion is going to do anything except repeat and sink further into flamewar.
  - esaym 8y ago
    >Neither of those doctors have published anything peer-reviewed And? If you have a mechanic friend who says "Toyota's latest family sedan has many problems", do you then ask where's his peer-reviewed research? No, because he is speaking of a direct observation. Vaccine injuries are eye witness accounts as well as seeing the lobbying power that vaccine manufactures have. You just have to look.

RobertRoberts 8y ago

Here's two medical doctors that say the science isn't settled at all. In fact that the vaccine usage in it's current form is anti-scientific. Dr. Richard Halvorsen (England) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMs1ue8j9CM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMs1ue8j9CM Dr. Suzanne Humphries (USA) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFQQOv-Oi6U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFQQOv-Oi6U

tombert 8y ago
There are over 1 million doctors in the US [1]. Of course you will be able to find one that supports nearly any ludicrous claim. There has been extensive research on vaccines in the major scientific literature, and the research has overwhelmingly reached the conclusion that there is no link with autism. [1] https://www.statista.com/topics/1244/physicians/ https://www.statista.com/topics/1244/physicians/
- RobertRoberts 8y ago
  Dr. Humphries specifically addresses the issue of those 1 million doctors in her talk. Your argument is a logical fallacy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum
  - tombert 8y ago
    It's hardly an argument ad populum to say that the overwhelming amount of research says vaccines have no link to autism. That's simply asserting an undeniable fact Moreover, are you seriously asserting the argument of "because one doctor says something, it has to be right"? I'm sorry, but the scientific process trusts the research, simple as that, and I largely trust the scientific process. The argument isn't "I think vaccines are safe because most of the world says so", my argument is "in the overwhelming amount of research that has been done on this, it has determined no link between vaccines and autism".
    - RobertRoberts 8y ago
      The linked sources aren't saying "don't vaccinate", they are saying "weigh the risks". There is not a single scientific source anywhere that says vaccines have zero side effects and/or zero negative effects on _everyone_. (it's common knowledge that immune compromised people can't even take vaccines)
- sathishmanohar 8y ago
  The science is not settled. There is more and more new data coming out everyday linking vaccines and autism. Here is a discussion about the data set from a pediatric hospital in America. The concerned Doctor Paul Thomas is not even against vaccines. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bjvjf4MnFqc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bjvjf4MnFqc In reply to tombert If you want to go over more than 1000 studies about vaccines published in established scientific journal get a copy of Neil Z Miller's book https://www.amazon.com/Vaccine-Safety-Concerned-Families-Practitioners/dp/188121737X https://www.amazon.com/Vaccine-Safety-Concerned-Families-Pra... For those who want a summary go through this video with references to studies https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoT10nxZrVo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoT10nxZrVo
  - tombert 8y ago
    Ok, can you please send me a paper from a reputable scientific journal? Any idiot can make a YouTube video claiming whatever the hell they want. Look at how big the flat-earth movement is on YouTube. If you link me to a paper in a peer-reviewed journal, I'd be happy to read it.
  - tombert 8y ago
    How about linking me to one study, in a peer reviewed journal.
- esaym 8y ago
  >There has been extensive research on vaccines in the major scientific literature, You should probably look into said "research" and see who actually funded it. Finding research that was not directly funded by a pharmaceutical is quite rare.
_underfl0w_ 8y ago
You posted this same comment in another thread and were quickly fact-checked. Neither of those doctors have published anything peer-reviewed on the subject or in an adjacent field. Just because it's on YouTube doesn't mean it's accurate.
- RobertRoberts 8y ago
  I wasn not presenting them as "doctors" as an authority, but the facts they present while being doctors. Do you believe that who they are as a person is more or less important than the facts they present?
  - dang 8y ago
    Please stop now. At this point you've crossed into trolling, and there's no way this discussion is going to do anything except repeat and sink further into flamewar.
- esaym 8y ago
  >Neither of those doctors have published anything peer-reviewed And? If you have a mechanic friend who says "Toyota's latest family sedan has many problems", do you then ask where's his peer-reviewed research? No, because he is speaking of a direct observation. Vaccine injuries are eye witness accounts as well as seeing the lobbying power that vaccine manufactures have. You just have to look.