4 ms·

Isn't semi-auto basically every gun except revolvers and bolt-action rifles? I thought "semi-auto" just meant you could pull the trigger, get a bullet, and the

Isn't semi-auto basically every gun except revolvers and bolt-action rifles? I thought "semi-auto" just meant you could pull the trigger, get a bullet, and then pull the trigger again for another bullet (as opposed to full auto where you keep getting bullets until you let go of the trigger or run out of bullets).

ceejayoz 8y ago
Click the link. It has a section titled "What semi-automatic firearms will not be affected by the ban?"
- CompanionCuuube 8y ago
  > Semi-automatic .22 calibre rimfire firearms with a magazine which holds no more than 10 rounds Oh, so the same weapon used in Virginia Tech, one of the worst school shootings in US history.
  - ceejayoz 8y ago
    I believe NZ (as some US states do) regulates pistols differently than rifles/shotguns. The VT shooter also had at least some fifteen round magazines. Ultimately, the policy goal is gonna be damage reduction. NZ likely understands that perfect protection isn't possible.
    - Kephael 8y ago
      If there's damage reduction, how can French terrorists outfit themselves like Soviet soldiers circa 1982? It's getting easier to manufacture high quality firearms on your own, not harder.
      - ceejayoz 8y ago
        If NZ shared a continent with Eastern Europe, they'd probably have more trouble. I suspect it's substantially harder to bring guns into a country surrounded by ocean (especially one with just a handful of air/sea ports) than it is to just walk them across minimal land borders. People still manage to murder, but that doesn't mean we make it legal.
        Kephael 8y ago
        The only parts that are difficult to make are the pressure bearing parts, and those can be ordered and shipped into the country via a freight forwarding service. Changes in the law only stop the dysfunctional, mentally ill but not terrorists. I can literally bake a lower receiver out of plastic in my oven or make one on my 3D printer. For something a bit nicer I can buy, and setup a CNC machine which only cost a few thousand dollars.
        ceejayoz 8y ago
        Sure. Just like you could strangle someone to death, but doing so is still illegal. Yes, you can probably build or smuggle a gun if you're determined enough. I'm OK with stopping "the dysfunctional, mentally ill" you mention, and having them be outright illegal increases the chances of someone seeing them and tipping off the cops, being dunned in by an informant, or them being intercepted at customs, a traffic stop, etc. You correctly highlight that this sort of thing is difficult, and won't ever be a 100% solution. Your apparent conclusion - that we shouldn't ever do anything - doesn't logically follow.
        Kephael 8y ago
        It's easy for someone who is somewhat mechanically inclined to manufacture a firearm, these law changes will not stop the next terrorist attack in New Zealand.
        ceejayoz 8y ago
        Of course not. That's a tautology. It may reduce the frequency and effectiveness of such attacks, as Australia's tightening of gun laws did for shootings. I'll take it.
        Kephael 8y ago
        All this does is further disarm the populace and makes it even easier to carry out an attack. Australia or New Zealand could have an attack like this happen tomorrow, it's not like they are able to keep handguns and drugs away from your normal criminal gang member there, let alone a determined terrorist.
      - CompanionCuuube 8y ago
        There's strong evidence that it wasn't even the types of guns that made a difference in Australia. http://theconversation.com/regulating-people-not-just-guns-might-explain-australias-decline-in-mass-shootings-44770 http://theconversation.com/regulating-people-not-just-guns-m...
pjc50 8y ago
Sort of - lots of guns can be manufactured as both, or converted between them by the addition/removal of parts.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
CompanionCuuube 8y ago
Yes, and this ban is against "military style" semi automatics. They believe that being able to accept a detachable magazine makes a gun "military style". It's tremendously idiotic.
- ceejayoz 8y ago
  Meh. If it successfully bans the guns they're looking to ban, and not the ones they didn't, does it matter what they called them?
  - CompanionCuuube 8y ago
    > If it successfully bans the guns they're looking to ban, and not the ones they didn't, does it matter what they called them? Do you mean the lobbyists or the general public? If you ask the general public to pick out which ones are not "military style" you're going to find that a lot of the ones banned don't get picked. So it doesn't meet your criteria for success.

ceejayoz 8y ago

Click the link. It has a section titled "What semi-automatic firearms will not be affected by the ban?"

CompanionCuuube 8y ago
> Semi-automatic .22 calibre rimfire firearms with a magazine which holds no more than 10 rounds Oh, so the same weapon used in Virginia Tech, one of the worst school shootings in US history.
- ceejayoz 8y ago
  I believe NZ (as some US states do) regulates pistols differently than rifles/shotguns. The VT shooter also had at least some fifteen round magazines. Ultimately, the policy goal is gonna be damage reduction. NZ likely understands that perfect protection isn't possible.
  - Kephael 8y ago
    If there's damage reduction, how can French terrorists outfit themselves like Soviet soldiers circa 1982? It's getting easier to manufacture high quality firearms on your own, not harder.
    - ceejayoz 8y ago
      If NZ shared a continent with Eastern Europe, they'd probably have more trouble. I suspect it's substantially harder to bring guns into a country surrounded by ocean (especially one with just a handful of air/sea ports) than it is to just walk them across minimal land borders. People still manage to murder, but that doesn't mean we make it legal.
      - Kephael 8y ago
        The only parts that are difficult to make are the pressure bearing parts, and those can be ordered and shipped into the country via a freight forwarding service. Changes in the law only stop the dysfunctional, mentally ill but not terrorists. I can literally bake a lower receiver out of plastic in my oven or make one on my 3D printer. For something a bit nicer I can buy, and setup a CNC machine which only cost a few thousand dollars.
        ceejayoz 8y ago
        Sure. Just like you could strangle someone to death, but doing so is still illegal. Yes, you can probably build or smuggle a gun if you're determined enough. I'm OK with stopping "the dysfunctional, mentally ill" you mention, and having them be outright illegal increases the chances of someone seeing them and tipping off the cops, being dunned in by an informant, or them being intercepted at customs, a traffic stop, etc. You correctly highlight that this sort of thing is difficult, and won't ever be a 100% solution. Your apparent conclusion - that we shouldn't ever do anything - doesn't logically follow.
        Kephael 8y ago
        It's easy for someone who is somewhat mechanically inclined to manufacture a firearm, these law changes will not stop the next terrorist attack in New Zealand.
        ceejayoz 8y ago
        Of course not. That's a tautology. It may reduce the frequency and effectiveness of such attacks, as Australia's tightening of gun laws did for shootings. I'll take it.
        Kephael 8y ago
        All this does is further disarm the populace and makes it even easier to carry out an attack. Australia or New Zealand could have an attack like this happen tomorrow, it's not like they are able to keep handguns and drugs away from your normal criminal gang member there, let alone a determined terrorist.
    - CompanionCuuube 8y ago
      There's strong evidence that it wasn't even the types of guns that made a difference in Australia. http://theconversation.com/regulating-people-not-just-guns-might-explain-australias-decline-in-mass-shootings-44770 http://theconversation.com/regulating-people-not-just-guns-m...

pjc50 8y ago

Sort of - lots of guns can be manufactured as both, or converted between them by the addition/removal of parts.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

CompanionCuuube 8y ago

Yes, and this ban is against "military style" semi automatics. They believe that being able to accept a detachable magazine makes a gun "military style". It's tremendously idiotic.

ceejayoz 8y ago
Meh. If it successfully bans the guns they're looking to ban, and not the ones they didn't, does it matter what they called them?
- CompanionCuuube 8y ago
  > If it successfully bans the guns they're looking to ban, and not the ones they didn't, does it matter what they called them? Do you mean the lobbyists or the general public? If you ask the general public to pick out which ones are not "military style" you're going to find that a lot of the ones banned don't get picked. So it doesn't meet your criteria for success.